– English Lyrics

Lyrics & Translation

[English]

AI can help us be the self we're trying

to be

and the the person we intend to be in an

interaction with someone else by telling

us where our blind spots are, what we

may be missing,

[Music]

I'm really interested um you know what

do you think if you're start if

someone's starting out in their careers

these days you know in the in the you

know era of AI

you know going into an entry level job

or something you know what what should

they be thinking about what's the

it's a great question I mean ra in

general I think and it's been true for a

for a time even before AI in the last

couple of years

really um lit up in a big way it's been

true for a while that sort of being a

ravenous continuous learner was probably

going to be the secret to success in

life. And that's very um that sounds

easy. Uh it sounds easy to have a growth

mindset. I mean people just say you know

everyone thinks they love to learn

because in some sense we do uh in some

sense human beings do love to learn and

that's innate. Um, but really loving to

learn as an adult in the real world

whose performance is being evaluated,

who has real consequences, right, for

success and failure. It gets awfully

hard to love to learn

because you really are so focused on

looking like you already know

everything, right? That's the headsp

space that we get into. You're terrified

to not look like you you already know

it. And of course that then sort of

forces people into wanting to stay safe,

to stay with what's familiar. And we

really need to to fight that that I

think that the pace of change is not

going to slow down. you know, the

company I work for, we work in the space

of customer service and and using AI and

customer service and you know, the

people that are that are speaking on

phones and and using chats uh you know

with with consumers, you know, it used

to be uh before AI that there was a a

coach uh a manager quality manager that

would basically listen into one in 10 of

their calls or would look review one in

50 of their emails uh and then

subjectively give feedback to And and

the argument would be, well, you just

looked at you listened to my crappy

call. All my other calls were great. You

know, what about the other ones, you

know? So, so we have software that's

been around for quite a while now using

AI that's listening to every call that

they do that is monitoring every email

and actually scoring uh those people on

how well they do, the behaviors they

demonstrate, the outcomes they generate,

all that kind of stuff. So, that allows

you basically to understand the areas

for development. It's not down to, you

know, a coach's opinion on that day who

maybe had a bad night the night before

and is in a bad mood. And then there's

really clever ways of actually executing

that training. You can do very, very

specific AIdriven training for a

particular behavior. You could, for

example, give a demonstration of another

call with someone that one of your

colleagues did where they did a great

example of that particular behavior. And

we even have examples of um uh simulated

customers. So we know a particular uh

agent or employee struggles in this

situation. So we'll s have an AI

simulate a customer uh that will test

that situation and the AI can give

training to the individual the employee

to say look you should have said this

rather than this you should have done

that rather than that.

That's there's such a great example of I

think where the potential for AI rests

in learning and development. Um because

you have you you touched on so many

things I think that are important. Um

one is the idea of really quality

feedback. Feedback in the human and

human world is subjective inherently.

And truthfully a lot of research

suggests the feedback you give is as

much about you as it is about the person

you're giving feedback to for better or

worse. Um, so that that ability to be

getting really rich feedback that is a

little bit less perhaps grounded in your

own like you know kind of subjective

state. I think also you know your

ability to get feedback at the moment

that you could use the feedback. You

know nudging behavior

is much more effective if you can nudge

the behavior in the moment that the

behavior is occurring which is again

very difficult for human managers or

human co-workers to do. Y

but AI can actually kind of give you

that when you could use it most where

it's most likely to change

your performance. So I I think that

those are some of the those are some of

the things that are really rich and and

the idea of also being able to practice

particularly challenging behaviors in a

less threatening environment. The the

reality is human beings care inherently

about what other human beings think of

them.

Sure. And so in in any situation with

another human being present

um it's inherently evaluative even when

people don't want it to be even way they

say it's a have a growth mindset this is

a safe space it's okay to make mistakes

and even if you really mean that on some

level human beings are still going to be

concerned about how they look and there

is that potential with an AI coach in an

AI based simulation to feel about as

free as you can feel I'm Not actually

even sure the evaluation concerns go

away completely, but but but less

threatening, right? Um

more free for to kind of try trial and

error, to do something new, to be

curious, to explore. I think that is one

of the things as a learning scientist

that makes me

really excited about AI to create safe

spaces for people to practice difficult

conversations.

um to practice, you know, giving a

client bad news. That's never a fun or

or or your boss, telling telling

somebody something that you suspect they

may not want to hear. Um and trying to

do that in a way that doesn't demotivate

them or, you know, these these are hard

things. So, I I love that AI can help us

with that. So, I think for young people

coming into the workplace, don't lose

your curiosity. Keep trying to

ravenously learn as many things as you

can. And then again, I think with AI, be

very thoughtful about the shortcuts you

you may be tempted to take at some point

in the, you know, in the moment you

might be able to kind of get the job

done, but eventually you're going to pay

the price because you aren't learning.

So, I think that's one of the things I'd

say, you know, we really have to

exercise some willpower around

is again either trying to use AI as

something that helps you get started.

Yep. Um, but you are still going to do

the synthesis. You're still going to

pull all the notes together. Or

conversely, you start by pulling all the

notes together and then you have the AI

help refine it. What am I missing? What

am I not thinking about how could I

communicate this more effectively? And

and try to use AI as a coach

to give you tips rather than ask it to

rewrite it for you.

Um, again, I recognize that that takes a

lot of discipline. Um, but it's really

going to pay off in the end when you are

in fact an expert

and others who took shortcuts are not.

Yep. You're you're 100% and I think you

hit the nail on the head with the growth

mindset.

Yeah.

You know, and and rather than the fixed

mindset to to recognize that you've

always got room to grow and learn. If

you think back, you know, I don't know,

70, 80 years, people, you know, you had

one profession. Yeah. You go out, you'd

learn that profession that would be your

life's work. That one thing you know for

the last 20 30 years kind of you know

people have had two or three professions

you know as technology came through and

changed things each time these waves. I

think what we're going to see with AI is

that every couple of years. So you're

only going to get through that with the

growth mindset with the recognizing that

what you learned two years ago is no

longer relevant. It's time to learn

again. And you absolutely another good

point which is you know AI is is like a

high performance car or a you know it's

an amazing tool.

It doesn't mean that that everyone can

use that high performance car or tool

the same way.

So then there's the you know knowing

prompt engineering for example you know

being an expert prompt engineer is the

equivalent of being a you know an

amazing car racing driver or something.

You know how to move that car really

really quickly. But that will change

again in a couple of years. So, but I

think you you you really hit it with the

growth mindset's key. I

I'm curious what you think about because

I would say like sort of the two major

categories I hear from leaders who are

reluctant to have their people using AI.

Um

you know that there's even I've heard

the phrase AI shaming, right? To kind of

really discouraging people from using

it. The one concerned we talked about

which is I'm I'm worried my people won't

learn. I'm worried they won't build

expertise. But the other one of course

is is the is the accuracy

um concern, right? And and that you know

again there's a lot of sort of headlines

about hallucinations. It's making up law

cases. It's making up uh citations for

science articles that don't exist.

Um

how do you think about that and and and

and how worried are you about that? and

and and and what if anything do you

think people need to be again those

young people who are starting to use AI

in their roles how they need to be

thinking about how they evaluate output

how they think about whether or not

something I can trust what I'm getting

it's super to the second question first

of all and that's about being really

good at prompt engineering the questions

you ask uh an LLM you know

conversational AI is key and so asking

the right questions is prompt

engineering so getting the right answers

is you can very easily ask an ambiguous

question that is very open to multiple

interpretations that's going to more

likely produce a hallucination that's

today it's early days in a in a year or

so you know it'll be selfcorrecting and

better than that I believe

the first part of your question you know

does it make people lazy

um you could say the same thing you you

know oh we have GPS in our cars now does

it

does it make you lazy that you don't

carry a map around pull over every 10

miles and check the map kind of thing.

Well, kind of. Yes. But actually, you're

no longer focusing on navigation. You've

outsourced that to to something else.

So, you maybe you listen to a podcast

while you're driving your car. Point

being is that that um you know yes it's

going to change things that we

previously had great we we applied great

value to you know writing an essay on

something whatever you know but then it

elevates us to something that's even

more valuable and even greater um done

done correctly long as technology is not

not um you know it's the equivalent of

someone moves from sewing clothes to you

know building the machines that that uh

makes clothes for example or a fashion

designer because we can produce so much

in the way of clothing these days

there's new roles around fashion design

as well because it's it's now

commoditize the production of clothes as

a commodity the so AI is going to do the

same thing it's going to commoditize

things that we previously held a lot of

value for

but then as you said will then elevate

to higher purpose higher value

activities

I love that thinking about the potential

for because you were talking about, you

know, the right prompt can mitigate

the odds of a terrible answer. And we

think about that with, you know,

confirmation bias, right? If if you

write a prompt and you say, "Tell me why

Taylor Swift is the greatest songwriter

who ever lived, then uh then it's going

to tell you why she is." And if you say,

but if they were to say, and then tell

me who does if there's anyone who

doesn't think that and why they don't

think that, now you're going to get, and

it's literally what we teach when we

teach decision- making.

Um, and for how people to think about

how, you know, now not to fall prey to

certain assumptions or certain biases,

you're kind of building it in.

But it's also,

you know, the reality is if you just

took a decision-making course as a

leader

10 years ago, we would teach you all of

these techniques on on how to make

better decisions. Some of them are quite

challenging. If I say, well, you need to

to engage in critical thinking, let's

say. Uh you need to think about all of

the assumptions you're making and

surface them.

Well, that's a

that's a challenging thing to do.

Assumptions are are almost inherently

unconscious. So, even if I sit there for

a long time and I think about what are

all the assumptions I'm making that are

leading to this decision, I may get some

of them.

um maybe if I'm using the perspectives

of other people, I'll surface a bit

more. AI can be a brilliant partner in

decision making because you can ask it,

hey, what are some of the assumptions I

may be making here? And the odds, you

know, it'll find some and go, oh yeah,

you know what? I am making that

assumption. Is that okay, is that a

valid assumption? Is there information

suggests that that assumption is no

longer true? things we told people to do

for decades to make better decisions

are so much easier.

Yeah.

With something like AI to augment the

process

and what you just just described is

prompt engineering. You know that that's

exactly it. Giving telling it

assumptions validate my assumptions is

prompt engineering. So it's a it's it's

something that was meaningless. No one

had heard of prompt engineering 2 years

ago, right? But you know many

entry-level jobs that come up in the

future I believe this will be a

fundamental prerequisite and being good

at that I imagine there'll be degree

courses at least for a few years until

it's succeeded around you know clever

smart uh prompt engineering to get the

best out of that high performing vehicle

which is AI. Well, and and again, it's

one of those things where, you know, we

there there's a certain expedience to

having people write mega prompts and

then you go, okay, here you can use my

mega prompt. Okay, that's fast. I get

it. But what's even better is to really

have people studying the process of

because then you are learning.

In order to make a really great mega

prompt that takes me through a whole

process,

I need to understand why each piece of

that prompt was necessary. And so along

the way I'm learning things like well

there's something called the

confirmation bias. If you ask a question

a certain way asking for evidence for

one thing that's what you're going to

get right. So so it's exciting for me to

think about all the things we can teach

through the process of teaching

prompting that helps people to arrive at

better questions

better and more thorough understanding

of information. You know how do we get

people to think rationally about risk?

That's incredibly hard. Loss aversion is

a very strong impulse um in the brain.

But through really good prompting, we

can get people to actually think through

information in a much more even-handed

way. So, I'm I'm very excited

about the future of decision making. Y

with AI because it's not about AI making

the decision for you.

It's about it really helping you to see

the things that you might be missing.

Um, which I think and treating it like

the the futurist Bob Johansson said this

in one of his books and it cracked me up

but I think it's a really great analogy

that that AI at least in current in its

current state is sort of like a a a

really well- read but overly confident

intern

that's with you all the time. And I love

that idea's only as good as the training

it's got

and as the person who again is sort of

behind the wheel. Yeah. Yeah.

Um, and I think that that that human in

the loop part is so important that we're

still going to need people.

I mean, when you think about that, what

are the things you think of that we're

kind of always or at least for the

foreseeable future going to want a human

playing a role in sort of like there's

the things we'll let AI do and that

we'll let agents do. Where to you are

the most important places for

humans to still actually be a big part

of the equation? Very very good question

and and um you know I think everyone's

going to be different

um you know clearly there's moments that

matter uh where you need that human

connection um you know and and it may be

an emotional moment it may be something

that's uh requires empathy um it could

be something that's of massive

significance that can't go wrong um so I

think uh you know we're going to need

that that moment but what's interesting

is those moments that matter

where there's a human probably that

human you're interacting with is

leveraging AI,

you know, in some way to to make them

super human to help the problem that you

have.

um you know and again we're talking a

little bit about business here and

there's kind of the other aspect I think

this that that really is interesting is

how AI is going to help people in their

personal lives you know and it's uh

you know and that human connection and

stuff and that so and and you know I

think I'm really interested in your

opinion as a psychologist in this you

know we're all familiar with the the

algorithm you know and the rabbit hole

and the fact that that social media is

is is is is so personalized that it

takes people down these kind of rabbit

holes of very individualist lonely

places in many cases.

And I I you know I've got a strong hope

that we're going to use AI to to create

shared communities, shared water cooler

type places of like-minded people, you

know, who can get together and share

things either in the real world or in,

you know, in in virtual spaces as well

rather than kind of this this the rabbit

holes we find ourselves in today. I

mean, I think in general that I believe

that that's going to be the case. I do

feel

to me some of the places where AI can

help us be better humans the most are

those places where for some reason or

another there is sort of a human quirk

or a or a a or a sort of a limited

capability that AI can help us augment.

Right? So, right now the solution for

not going down the rabbit hole is people

say put your phone down.

Okay. Well, that's hard, right? Because

my phone is full of interesting things.

Um, and all kinds of things that give me

those little dopamine hits that I'm I'm

looking at. They'll also give me a lot

of dopamine deficit, but it'll give me

those dopamine hits. And very often, you

know, when do we want people to put

their phone down? Well, we want them to

put it down at night

because there's lots of research that

shows it's terrible to be on your phone

right before you try to get sleep. Um,

when do we have the least willpower to

do something like that? at night,

right?

Because you have spent it. Willpower is

a limited resource. We all spend it all

day long. Every time we make decisions,

every time we resist an impulse, every

time someone sends you an email and you

don't immediately fly off the handle

with a we're using that limited supply

and and as we go out, I mean, this is

why happy hour exists, right? By the end

of the day, it all just, you know, that

it seems like a really good idea. So I

think those places where AI can really

help us be the people we want to be is

where we can use it as a almost like you

would a human partner who is saying hey

like you know this is really the time

you wanted to put your phone down let's

do something else instead that it's it's

helping manage your day

giving you little tips like hey maybe

you want to you've been staring at your

computer screen for 2 hours maybe you

should do something for five minutes

that replenishes you and puts a little

bit of that gas back in the tank and I

happen to know that you enjoy these

kinds of 5minute activities. Here are

some suggestions. Right? So I think it's

really exciting. I think those places

where we struggle to be our best selves

um where we have our blind spots where

we kind of maybe there are unconscious

forces that are undermining the pursuit

of our goals. That AI can play a role in

helping us

um in those moments where we need it

most. I think is so exciting.

It's it's really cool. It's it's connect

argument I have with my kids um around

AI and personalization. So and

especially with art for example. So you

know we're all familiar with like

playlist of you know

music that's that's you know created for

you the you know based on what you

listen to what you've liked you know you

get a list of songs that that predicted

you'll like.

In the age of AI you know this will go

beyond you know there'll be music that's

created for you. you know, it's not an

artist that exists. It's just AI that's

created the perfect music for you for

that moment

or even the perfect movie

for you in that moment. You know, that

that what you need at that time.

So, one of the arguments I have with my

kids is quite interesting. It goes this

kind of idea of a rabbit hole cuz

the movie that's created just for you at

that particular time is the ultimate

rabbit hole. You're you're in this

lonely place watching this lonely movie

created for you, but it's hitting all

the dopamine you need at that time. Um

my kids argument which is quite

interesting is is the idea of community.

Um you know and actually part of the

reason they like a movie or like a song

isn't because it's good for them but

they know other people like it as well

and other people have watched it as

well. So sure. Yeah. So, so what's quite

interesting to me is, you know, if AI is

going to generate content, you know, to

what degree is that personalized? Is it

personalized to the individual or to a

group of friends or to a society or to

humankind?

Great question. It's such a social

psychologist question because we we

think about I when we think about

identity for years, for decades, social

psychologists have thought about

identity as being a com. It isn't it

isn't who you are individually or your

group identities. It's all of those.

Right? So you are a unique individual

but the groups to which you belong um

that are meaningful to you um along all

kinds of different those are important

as well. And but and what tends to be

the case is that people fluctuate a bit.

Um so it it can fluctuate by culture.

So, in some cultures, your group

identities tend to be more important

than your individual identity, right?

Um, and vice versa. But I think it's

also going to move kind of throughout

your day where there may be moments

where what you're really craving is

something that is uniquely for you

and that's that's the that's the piece

you want in that moment. But I think

there's also always going to be the

things that you feel connect you to

other people.

Yes. Um, so it's probably an it's an and

it's probably I do want some there may

be an evening where I want the movie

that was made for me. There may be more

evenings where I want something that I

feel like I can I can share with people

or that others are sharing with me. And

I think we're going to see that it's

it's quite fluid because I I I for one,

it's funny that

thinking about creativity and the arts.

Um, I do see that there we certainly

artists are already and will continue to

augment their art through with AI as a

helper. I do think it still matters to

people and probably again will

uh forever because I think it's a human

nature thing that there is a human

behind the art, right? That there's a a

human behind the music.

Um, there's a human behind a great piece

of of pros or or or film making or or a

designer. Um, however, that they'll be

augmented a bunch certainly. Um, and and

I think I I think it will always matter,

but I think there will be those moments.

It's like elevator music. There's going

to just be some times you're like, "No,

I just want the manifest." Yeah, I just

want the thing that was manufactured for

me right now.

Um, and then I think there'll be times

where just really where the meaning

comes from

uh the meaning of something comes from

the sharedness with other humans. I

think that's probably always going to be

true.

I think that's 100%. And you know, in

the same way that sometimes we'll want a

burger,

you know, and other times we want like,

you know, a beautiful meal in a really

nice restaurant.

Absolutely.

Life's about the all of those choices

and having those as well. And I'm hoping

that

AI doesn't just become fast food for

everyone. Uh, and we have, you know, the

right, you know, the right approach to

it like we do with other parts of our

lives. So,

well, Barry, I just want to thank you so

much. This was so much fun. I mean, this

is one this is one of these topics I

can't stop talking about. Um, but it was

really great to to be able to talk to

someone who is, I think, not only sort

of at the forefront of what we are doing

today with AI, but someone who's

thinking so deeply about what we're

going to be doing with it in the future.

So, thank you.

That's a pleasure. And thank you, Heidi.

It's really, really good to speak to an

expert in behavioral psychology. And,

uh, I think it's going to be interesting

years ahead as AI, you know, wave hits

and what it means for people. So, you've

got some interesting interesting work

ahead and thank you for your time.

Yeah, I think we'll both have lots to

do. Yes. So, thanks.

Cheers.

Key Vocabulary

Vocabulary	Meanings
learn /lɜːrn/ A1	verb - to gain knowledge or skill through study or experience
feedback /ˈfiːd.bæk/ B1	noun - information about reactions to a product, a person's performance, etc., used as a basis for improvement
growth /ɡroʊθ/ A2	noun - the process of developing or increasing in size, value, or importance
mindset /ˈmaɪn.dset/ B2	noun - a person's way of thinking and their opinions
augment /ɔːɡˈmɛnt/ C1	verb - to make something greater by adding to it
prompt /prɒmpt/ B1	noun - a cue or hint to help someone remember or think of something verb - to assist or encourage someone to do something
decision /dɪˈsɪʒən/ A2	noun - a choice made between two or more possibilities
curiosity /ˌkjʊəriˈɒsəti/ B2	noun - a strong desire to know or learn something
synthesize /ˈsɪnθəsaɪz/ C1	verb - to combine different ideas, styles, or materials to create something new
evaluate /ɪˈvæljuːeɪt/ B2	verb - to assess or judge the value or quality of something
potential /pəˈtenʃəl/ B1	noun - the capacity to develop or achieve something in the future
discipline /ˈdɪsəplɪn/ B2	noun - the practice of training people to obey rules or a code of behavior
community /kəˈmjuːnɪti/ B1	noun - a group of people living in the same place or having a particular characteristic in common