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Alan: This episode is sponsored by Squarespace. 00:00
The all-in-one platform to build a beautiful website and brand. 00:01
Ben: I mean, am I not allowed to be friends with people that are hot? I mean... 00:05
Jono: Are you 12? 00:09
Ben: I have to actively stop my brain from thinking about you. 00:11
Jono: Are you a decent human being or not? 00:14
Alan: It's bad. Really really bad. But hey, the people are pretty. 00:15
Connor: You are sexy. Very sexy. 00:18
And... cute. 00:21
Jono: Horrible, for everybody involved. 00:23
Janine: Aren't we gonna... deal with this? 00:25
Alan: Love as a concept is this froofy thing 00:28
that the movie spends a ton of time talking about? 00:31
What love actually is, is doing it. 00:33
Jono: Caring about the other person's comfort and their happiness without expectation. 00:36
Alex: You are my exception. 00:40
Jono: That's love. 00:42
They make valid points, but there are some things 00:46
that get under my skin that I have to address right out of the gate. 00:47
Alan: Whoa! Hang on. You're blowing my mind. 00:50
Alan: Hello, and welcome to Cinema Therapy. 00:58
I'm Alan Seawright, a professional filmmaker who needs therapy. 01:00
That guy is not me. His name is... 01:03
Jono: Jonathan Decker, licensed therapist who is not Alan and loves movies. 01:05
Alan: Both of those things are true. 01:10
Jono: Speaking of which, what are we doing today? 01:11
Alan: I'm just gonna have you rank all the relationships in one movie. Jono: What movie? 01:12
Alan: They're all great. He's just not that into you. 01:15
So you're gonna be ranking them from exceptional to perfect. 01:18
Jono: Oh my gosh... 01:21
He's Just Not That Into You is also a reference 01:23
to how Alan feels about this movie. 01:25
Alan: He isn't. 01:28
Jono: All these relationships are terrible, 01:29
Jono: except for maybe one and a half of them. Alan: Okay. 01:30
Jono: But let's talk about why, 01:33
and what we can learn from this dumpster fire. 01:34
Alan: Who would you rank the absolute worst? 01:36
I know exactly who it is, but go ahead and say it. 01:37
Jono: It's Anna and Ben. 01:39
Alan: Of course it [beeping] is. 01:40
Jono: Because we're romanticizing adultery. 01:42
Actually, the movie's not. 01:45
But they are, and it goes really bad for them. 01:46
Ben: I mean, am I not allowed to be friends with people that are hot? 01:48
I mean, look, I mean... 01:51
Jono: Oh, yeah, that's innocent. 01:53
That's not... blatantly obvious and icky. 01:54
Anna: I mean... Jono: Icky goo. 01:57
Anna: ...am I not supposed to be friends with a guy 01:58
Anna: just because he's married? Ben: Right. 02:01
Anna: Or has an insane smile? 02:03
Or an ass that makes me want to dry hump? 02:05
Jono: Uh, well, because he's married, you probably shouldn't say that. Alan: Yeah. 02:08
Jono: You could be friends. You can't say that. 02:11
Alan: You probably shouldn't say that. 02:13
Like, you write that in the first draft of a script, 02:15
and then you write something better. 02:17
Ben: I think I just fell in love. 02:20
Jono: Ugh, so painful to watch. "I think I just fell in love". No. Anna: We're friends. 02:22
Jono: You both think of love like 13 year olds do. 02:30
You're using words like "dry hump". 02:33
Jono: Okay, so she's gonna skinny dip. 02:37
Alan: Sure. Jono: With her ffff... 02:39
Alan: As one does. With friends. Jono: We're friends. 02:40
Alan: Who make you want to dry hump their ass. 02:42
Jono: I don't know... Alan: I don't get it! 02:45
I don't understand the words you wrote. 02:47
Alan: They don't make sense. Jono: Yeah. 02:50
Alan: And look, I'm not kink shaming. 02:52
If dry humping asses is your thing... 02:53
You know, consenting adults. Fine. Great. 02:56
[Beep] this, I don't care. 03:00
Jono: He's married. Alan: Yeah. 03:02
Jono: She knows he's married. So, honor that. 03:04
Respect that, he's in a relationship. 03:06
So, you find him attractive, you like his eyes, 03:08
his butt makes you want to go woo woo woo woo. 03:10
Doesn't matter. Because are you a decent human being or not? 03:14
You don't go after someone who's in a relationship. 03:17
Jono: You respect that boundary. Alan: Yeah. 03:19
Jono: [exasperated sigh] And then he just sees her, 03:21
And even though he's committed to his wife and they're... 03:23
Supposed to be committed to his wife, 03:26
and they're remodeling a house together and planning a future together, 03:28
he literally just throws it away because she's pretty. 03:31
This other woman is pretty. 03:34
And he's like, am I not supposed to have friends with people who are hot? 03:35
Like, come on, are you 12? 03:39
Are you 12 and this is the lunch line? 03:42
Jono: Is this Big. This is a 12 year old boy in a man's body. Alan: Yeah. 03:44
Jono: It's not as good as Big. 03:48
It's like Big, if you got it from Temu. 03:49
And she is going for this. Why? Why? Is it lack of confidence? 03:51
Is it lack of self-worth that she's just gonna say, Well, 03:57
this guy likes me, and I think he's cute, 04:00
and he's charming and he's married, but that's fine. 04:01
They start talking about all these stories 04:03
of people who fell in love when someone else was married, 04:05
and they broke up the marriage and they got together, 04:07
but they were soulmates. 04:09
You want to know how often that happens? 04:10
Like 0.01% of the time. 04:12
Alan: I mean, the statistics on that, literally, you can look up the statistics. 04:14
They're abysmal. 04:17
Jono: Yeah, it's not exactly what I said, but... Alan: It never works. 04:18
Jono: Relationships that are based on 04:20
one partner betraying their current partner 04:22
to be with a new partner are already built on a foundation of lies, 04:24
and you know that the person you're with 04:28
is willing to cheat on someone that they're with. 04:31
Alan: Listen, if dude is going to cheat on his wife of whatever it is, 04:33
10 or 15 years, with you because you're the hotter, younger model, 04:36
what the [beep] do you think is going to happen to you in 10 years? 04:39
Jono: If she's going to go after someone who's married, 04:42
what does that say about her sense of commitment 04:44
and what that actually is? None of this works. 04:46
Alan: Nope. It's bad. It's really, really bad. But, hey, the people are pretty. 04:47
And scene. 04:51
Jono: It's the new car thing. It's the grass is greener thing. 04:53
You have a relationship. You have a commitment. 04:57
You have a life with somebody. 04:58
Jono: You commit to it and you work it out. Alan: Yeah. 05:00
Jono: Or you commit to it, try to work it out, 05:03
realize that it's not going to work, 05:05
and close that loop before you start something else. 05:06
Alan: But have you driven a new car? 05:10
[dial tone] 05:11
WHAAAT??? 05:14
Fine, fine, fine. I'm cool. I'm fine. 05:16
Jono: My issue is not that these characters are attracted to each other 05:18
or drawn to each other. 05:21
My issue is that they just feel these feelings and they go, Okay. 05:22
Alan: No, look, if this was a relationship between, you know, 05:26
Alan: two consenting adults who weren't in previous relationships, it's cute. Jono: Yeah. 05:29
Alan: Sure. Fine. Whatever. I mean, the dialog is still wretched, 05:33
but you forgive it because pretty. 05:38
Jono: But I will give the film credit for this. 05:39
Jono: The movie itself is not romanticizing this. Alan: True. 05:42
Jono: It is showing you what they think and feel, 05:44
and then they show you how it goes horrible for everybody involved. 05:46
And so props for that at least. 05:50
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Jono: Only slightly better is Anna and Connor. 07:15
Alan: Oh, really? I would... Okay. 07:18
Jono: But Anna is in the bottom two relationships here 07:20
because Anna is terrible. 07:22
ScarJo is fantastic. Anna is terrible. 07:24
Connor: Hey. Anna: Hey. 07:28
Connor: I'm psyched you called. Anna: Cool. 07:29
Connor: Kinda given up on you when you didn't call me back the other night. 07:31
Anna: Oh, no. I was just thinking about you. 07:33
Jono: Why would you say that? 07:36
Connor: Okay, what were the categories... 07:38
Alan: To manipulate. 07:38
Anna: ...or category. 07:40
Jono: This is why she's terrible. 07:41
Anna: Sexy, funny, and... 07:43
Jono: She knows she's leading him on. She knows they slept together once. 07:44
He wants nothing more than to be her man. 07:48
Anna: ...Parker would be funny. 07:49
Jono: And he is safe, and easy, and there 07:51
and emotionally supportive, and will rub her feet. 07:54
Anna: Oh, what am I? 07:56
Connor: Oh, wait. What was I again? 07:58
Anna: You're smart and cute. 07:59
Connor: Okay. You are sexy. Very sexy. And... 08:01
Jono: And he's... And he's flattering. 08:06
And he makes her feel good. And he builds her up. 08:07
Alan: He's also a moron. Sexy and cute. 08:10
Anna: ...all in one column. 08:12
Jono: No, that happens. 08:13
Connor: Like a jackass if I say... 08:14
Alan: Yeah, but if those are the only two defining traits. 08:15
Jono: Oh, no. Yeah, okay. 08:18
I thought you meant that a person can't be both. 08:19
But yeah, if he's saying these are your two defining traits. 08:21
Alan: No, person can be both cute and sexy. That's fine. 08:24
But if those are your two defining traits, then... 08:26
Jono: He's not a moron. Those are her only traits as a character. Alan: Oh, [beep]. You're right. 08:28
Jono: She's not smart and she's not decent. 08:32
Alan: So he is a moron. 08:35
But he's a moron for having feelings for a person he accurately described. 08:36
Jono: Yes. Alan: Okay. 08:39
Anna: ...totally, totally fried. Is that okay? 08:40
Connor: Yeah. 08:43
Jono: Why are you kissing him?! 08:44
Anna: I'll see you later. 08:49
Jono: You're into this married guy, but you've got this... 08:51
Internet Dads: Sidepiece. 08:54
Jono: Over here, and then you're gonna.. Alan: That look. 08:56
Jono: That look was pretty good. 09:00
Alan: Oh, man. Kevin Connolly. 09:01
They didn't give him much to do, 09:04
but he made the most of it with that look. 09:06
Alan: That look right there was his whole paycheck. 09:08
Jono: Yeah. Alan: It was great. 09:11
Jono: He nailed it. Well, listen, and I want to be very clear on something. 09:12
We're having a good time taking the piss out of this movie 09:15
and these relationships. 09:18
Neither of us were any smarter in our 20s. 09:19
Alan: No, no, no. Jono: Okay, so I'm not... This isn't us on our high horse. 09:21
Alan: Well, I never cheated in my 20s. 09:24
Jono: No, but as far as, like, going after somebody who was... 09:26
Clearly, you were way more invested in them than... than they were in you. 09:29
Alan: No, I did this... a lot. 09:32
Jono: Like, this relationship right here. I... That was my entire collegiate career. 09:34
Jono: That was my entire... Alan: I witnessed three of those. 09:38
Jono: You did witness three of those. 09:40
Alan: And it was... very sad. Jono: It was so sad. 09:42
Alan: I was... I kept waiting for the Kevin Connolly turn 09:45
and look at camera. And I never got it from you. 09:47
And I was like, Jono, turn to look at camera, buddy. 09:49
- How do you feel right now? 09:52
- I feel cocked. 09:54
- Do you fe-- Okay. 09:55
Jono: Meanwhile, like an idiot. Like this guy, 09:56
there were actually plenty of wonderful women 09:59
who were interested in me. 10:03
Maybe not plenty, but there were more than one. 10:04
Alan: Oh, it was plenty. Jono: Okay. 10:07
Jono: Thank you. Alan: I've got figures. 10:08
Jono: There were any number of actually would have been a great relationship. 10:10
And I, like a dummy, just wanted the whole forbidden fruit thing 10:13
or the want what you can't have. I don't even know why I was that way. 10:17
And I'm a psychoanalyst. 10:20
Maybe because I don't want to look in those dark corners of my mind. 10:22
Maybe I'm scared to go there. That's probably why I don't know. 10:26
Jono: I could discover it. I just don't want to. Alan: I just won't. 10:29
- Oh, yeah. The vault. That's where the stuff I can't handle goes. 10:33
Jono: But she uses him and he lets her. 10:36
And he knows he's being used, and she knows he's using him. 10:38
And you would say, Well, in that case, it's all mutual consent. 10:42
Yeah, but they're all consenting to something just objectively mean 10:44
and cruel and selfish and horrible. 10:47
Alan: If you're consenting to stupidity, it doesn't make you smart. 10:49
Jono: It just makes you a willing idiot. 10:54
Alan: But also, I would argue Connor is not fully consenting. 10:56
He doesn't have the entire context. 11:00
He doesn't know that she was just coming from essentially a rejection. And... 11:01
Jono: She needs comfort. 11:05
Alan: She needs comfort and to feel, like, she's desired and and loved by this guy. 11:07
Jono: So you're saying he's not consenting to being used 11:12
because he doesn't realize that's what's going on? 11:14
Alan: Correct. He doesn't realize the extent to which he's being used. 11:16
He's consenting to a small part of it, but not the whole enchilada. 11:19
Jono: So Connor is smart, but not when it comes to her. Alan: Correct. 11:22
Jono: Yeah. And that's why, after she leaves, 11:25
the smart part of him comes back and he's like, Wait... 11:26
Alan: Wait. I can't smell her anymore. Am I an idiot? 11:30
Jono: Number three is Ben and Janine. 11:33
Have you noticed that Ben and Anna occupy the bottom three slots on this list? 11:35
Alan: Frankly, look, rating them, they're just awful. Jono: Yeah. 11:39
Alan: There's a bottom tier, and it's Ben and Anna. Jono: Yeah. 11:43
Alan: We shouldn't even be numbering them. Like, they're just awful. 11:46
And then we get to rake some other ones. 11:49
Ben: I slept with someone. 11:52
Jono: You see how the camera changes position? Because it's a change... 11:54
Alan: Because there's a change of perspective. Jono: I learned that from you. 11:57
Alan: One thing I love about it, though, is the focus stays on her 12:00
and he's out of focus in the background. 12:03
It makes it about her, which is interesting. 12:04
Janine: Are you telling me this in Home Depot because you know I hate a public scene? 12:09
Ben: No, that is not why I'm telling you. 12:13
Janine: I knew it. I knew it. You a[beep]! 12:16
Ben: I'm sorry. I'm s--. 12:21
Janine: It is you that's been smoking too, isn't it? 12:23
Ben: What? Wait, what does that even matter? 12:27
Janine: HAVE YOU...? 12:29
Have you been smoking? 12:33
Jono: So the reason she's asking this is because in infidelity cases, 12:34
Jono: the lies are often as hurtful or more hurtful than the actual cheating. Alan: Sure. 12:38
Ben: Look, I talked to Neil. I told him, 12:43
and he said I could stay at his boat for a while. 12:45
Janine: Excuse me? 12:46
Now you're moving out. You're, like, leaving me. 12:49
Ben: No, no, I just assumed that you wouldn't want me to... 12:53
Janine: Aren't we gonna... deal with this? 12:58
Don't you want to find some way for us to work through this? 13:02
Ben: I assume that when I told you, you would want me.... out. 13:09
Janine: Is that what you want? 13:17
Alan: Fun little bit of sound design in the background there. 13:24
The lift. Like going eeeghsshh clunk. 13:26
Jono: I have to... Ben: No. 13:31
Janine: Okay. Okay. 13:36
Jono: So one of my areas of specialty in my practice is healing from infidelity. 13:39
Helping couples heal from infidelity. 13:43
And I have to give credit where it's due 13:45
to both the screenwriters and the actors. 13:47
Jono: The banter before he tells her... Alan: Stupid. 13:50
Jono: But from the moment he actually tells her, that whole conversation feels like... 13:53
Alan: Oh, it's... Jono: It's very real. 13:57
Alan: It's awesome. These are two really talented actors, 13:58
given an okay version of that, as a script, 14:01
and they're crushing it. 14:05
Jono: But this, this scene does feel very real, from him... Alan: Yeah. 14:06
Jono: Him saying it and her saying, Are you telling me now 14:09
because you don't want to make a scene? 14:12
And he says, No, it's just like this was the moment because of what you said. 14:13
Like, I couldn't bear it anymore to not tell you. 14:16
And then when she says, It is you who's smoking. 14:19
It seems like a stupid thing to pivot to. 14:22
Why aren't we talking about the affair? Why are you bringing up smoking? 14:24
It's not a stupid thing. 14:26
It all comes back to, What are you lying to me about? 14:28
Since this is out in the open, let's get it all on the table. 14:31
Because I want to know where I'm being deceived 14:33
and where the dishonesty is happening. 14:35
Alan: Honestly, to me, that's the best bit of screenwriting in the whole movie is, 14:36
is her fixation on this little lie 14:39
that isn't the biggest deal in the world next to the other stuff, it's fantastic. 14:43
Jono: I do like that she's kind of trying to... trying to save the marriage, 14:47
but he's insisting that he doesn't smoke 14:51
and later, when she finds the cigarettes, is when she's just done. 14:53
Alan: That's it. Yeah. 14:56
Jono: Because it's not about the smoking, it's about that even with this, 14:57
Jono: he's still lying to her. Alan: He's lying. 14:59
Jono: And when he says, I'm going to go stay with my buddy on his boat, 15:01
and she says, You want to move out? And he says, No, 15:04
I just assumed you wouldn't want me there. 15:06
And she said, Don't you want to fight for the marriage? 15:07
This is the most realistic scene in the movie, so props to them. 15:09
But as far as ranking the couple... 15:13
No. It's a marriage falling apart because of infidelity and dishonesty. 15:15
And I think I'm a bit more sympathetic to Janine than you are. 15:18
But I don't think you're attacking the character 15:22
as much as the writing anyway. 15:24
Alan: I'm attacking the writing and a little bit attacking the character, 15:25
but it's mainly just because I'm disappointed 15:28
because I love watching Jennifer Connelly be smart. 15:30
Jono: Listen, guys, we swear we love Jennifer Connelly. 15:33
I know we don't have the best track record with this. 15:36
Alan: We'll find a couple of movies to talk about. 15:38
Jono: Number two. Alex and Gigi. 15:41
This is where I actually start enjoying the couples and the movie. 15:43
- Wow, that is delicious. Finally, some good [beeping] food. 15:47
Jono: There's some problems here, 15:50
but they arrive at a very beautiful, healthy place. Let's take a look. 15:51
So he's been her dating coach, 15:57
and she thinks he's just trying to get close to her, 15:59
which he is, but he doesn't know it. 16:01
Alan: He's just not that into you. 16:04
Gigi: I knew it. The best relationships grow out of friendships. 16:06
Jono: And she's right. 16:10
Alex: Wait, wait. Gigi, hey. Wait, wait, wait. What? 16:11
Now you and I are in a relationship? 16:17
Gigi: Well, I'd say if we're not at relationship station ship, 16:19
we're at least on the track. 16:23
Alex: And why exactly would you think that? 16:26
Gigi: Because of the signs. 16:29
Alex: Really? Like what? 16:31
Gigi: Like it was good to hear from me. 16:33
And you talked to me even when you were with a girl 16:36
and... I... felt something? 16:39
Alex: What are you talking about, Gigi? What have I been saying since I met you? 16:45
If a guy wants to date you, he will make it happen, okay? 16:50
He will ask you out. Did I ask you out? 16:52
Gigi: No. 16:56
Alex: Why would you do this? Oh, [beep]. 16:57
Why do they even do this? Why do they build up this stuff in their minds? 17:02
Take each little thing a guy does and then twist it into something else. 17:05
It's insane! 17:09
Alan: Okay. What she did was literally insane. 17:11
Is it a thing a real person would do? 17:14
Jono: Yes. Alan: It... What? 17:16
Jono: No, not the pouncing thing, but the building it up in your mind thing. Alan: Oh, wow. 17:19
Gigi: ...be like that and be like you. 17:22
Alan: This is a fun... 17:25
Alex: Excuse me? What is that supposed to mean? 17:26
Alan: ...soliloquy that she gets. 17:28
Gigi: I may dissect each little thing and put myself out there too much, 17:32
but at least that means I still care. 17:37
Oh, you think you've won because women are expendable to you. 17:41
And you may not get... get hurt or make an ass of yourself that way. 17:46
But you don't fall in love that way either. 17:51
You have not won. You're alone, Alex. 17:54
Alan: True. But have you seen his loft? 18:04
Gigi: I may do a lot of stupid [beep], 18:05
but I know I'm a lot closer to finding someone than you are. 18:07
Jono: Okay. I have thoughts in a lot of different directions 18:15
about this scene and this relationship. 18:18
Jono: They both make valid points about the other. Alan: Sure. 18:20
Jono: But there's some things that get under my skin 18:23
that I have to address right out of the gate. 18:24
Alan: Go for it. 18:26
Jono: When he says, Why do women do this? 18:27
I hate lines like that because not all women are the same. 18:29
Any more than you can say anything about guys or any... 18:33
No... no group is a monolith. 18:36
Alan: Whoa! Hang on. You're blowing my mind. 18:37
Jono: So this was the great... This was the great struggle 18:39
of watching rom coms in the 90s and early 2000, when I was young, 18:42
Jono: and I didn't have a master's degree in healthy relationships. Alan: Right. 18:46
Jono: Is I would go to romantic comedies for advice on how to date. 18:50
♫♫ Oh my God ♫♫ 18:55
Jono: There, I said it. Alan: We all did. No, we all did. 18:57
Jono: Yeah, we all did. Alan: This is how we were raised. 18:58
Jono: We were like, what... Exactly. 19:01
We're like, What are the rules? Rom coms will teach us. 19:02
Alan: Rom coms will teach us. 19:04
Jono: I don't know why we're trusting these idiots 19:05
who write these things to tell us what love is. 19:07
Alan: Listen, if you're trusting William Shakespeare or Jane Austen... 19:09
Alan: Go with God. Jono: Yes. 19:13
Alan: If you're trusting whoever the [beep] this was... 19:14
I don't know. And I don't care. 19:18
I don't want to know who this was, because I don't want to respect them less. 19:19
Jono: Because you don't want to disrespect real people? Alan: I don't. 19:23
Jono: But Abby Kohn and Marc Silverstein, the writers of He's Just Not That Into You, 19:26
also gave us Never Been Kissed. 19:31
Alan: [Beep] them to hell. 19:36
It's also stupid. 19:36
That's not how the world works, movie. 19:38
Is it ever addressed in the movie 19:40
whether or not Drew Barrymore has actually been [beeping] kissed?! 19:41
I don't think... 19:44
It is. And she has. 19:45
What the [beep] are you doing? 19:47
Alan: That's it. Jono: Please don't... Um. Just get better at writing. 19:49
Jono: I'll soften that a little bit. Alan: Stop writing. 19:52
Find something else to do with your lives. 19:54
Don't do it anymore. 19:56
Jono: I resent when each of them talks about how men and women are. 19:57
And I also don't like the implication 20:00
Jono: that you have to be with somebody to be happy. Alan: Right. 20:02
Jono: She is so much closer to finding someone. But what if she just found herself? 20:06
Alan: Also, what if Justin Long is just happy living in an awesome place, 20:11
owning a bar and playing, what is it, NCAA football with models. 20:16
Seems like a pretty good life. Maybe he's just chill. 20:24
Jono: Now here's my... here's my issue with him 20:27
Jono: and where she hits the nail on the head when she says, Women are expendable to you. Alan: Yeah. 20:29
Jono: There's nothing wrong with if you're somebody who isn't ready for 20:33
or, frankly, doesn't want a committed long term relationship, 20:36
but you have to be upfront and transparent about that. 20:40
Alan: Yeah. If you can find someone else in the same boat. 20:43
Jono: Yeah. Or if you're looking f or casual relationships 20:45
or casual flings or whatever, but you have to be upfront about it. 20:48
And he doesn't do that. 20:51
He breaks women's hearts by leading them along, 20:52
and then he's giving her the inside track on how he and other guys do this 20:55
and how they'll act if they actually are into you. 20:59
But there's never really, on his part, an owning 21:02
Jono: that I'm kind of being an ass by treating people this way. Alan: Yeah. 21:04
Jono: And then on her part, again, what if she found herself first? 21:08
She is so fixated on finding love. It is her one... It is Gollum and the ring. 21:13
She is hunting for it. She will not stop. 21:18
Alan: It's worse than that. She's the freaking skunk from Warner Bros. 21:20
Jono: She's Pepe Le Pew? Alan: She's Pepe Le Pew. 21:24
Jono: Please don't cancel him, though. He's funny. Uh... 21:27
You know, it is not just a kiss of physical attraction. 21:30
I admire her mind, too. 21:34
Jono: But she is. I mean, this is her one purpose in life is to find love. 21:36
And she's very much in a headspace of, Until I do, I can't be happy and satisfied. 21:40
That's my critique of both of them. Now, what I really like about this scene 21:45
Jono: is the things that they point out in each other are pretty accurate. 21:48
Alan: Accurate. Jono: Yeah. 21:51
Jono: Here's why I have them at number two. 21:53
Jono: We're actually trending more positively towards something healthy. Alan: Okay. 21:54
Jono: Is he accepts influence from her. Alan: Yeah. 21:57
Jono: And that he engages in perspective taking. 22:01
And instead of saying where he started, You're crazy. What's wrong with you? 22:04
Like, a week later, he's like, Oh, now I'm crazy. 22:07
And I know exactly what was wrong with her 22:10
because it's the same thing that's wrong with me. 22:11
Jono: And it's called love. Alan: Awww. 22:12
Jono: Also accountability kink activated. 22:16
He does own his mistakes where he got it wrong 22:19
and that he can be better, the ways that he hurt her. 22:22
What we don't see him do is the actual work. 22:25
Because it's a movie and we don't have the time. 22:27
Alan: We don't have the time. And also we have way too many characters. 22:29
Jono: Yeah, this is a two hour movie that I really needed as a 15-minute short film. 22:32
That's what I needed. Okay. 22:36
Alan: I just didn't need it. 22:37
Jono: Number one is Beth and Neil. 22:38
This is the actual healthy relationship that I love in this movie. 22:40
Ben Affleck, Jennifer Aniston, she wants to get married, 22:44
he thinks marriage is just a piece of paper. 22:47
They break up over that. Her dad has a heart attack. 22:49
And her brothers and brothers in law are not pulling their weight and not helping. 22:51
Stephen: Dah, dah, dah, dah. Argh!. 22:57
Devon: It's so embarrassing. 23:00
George: What? 23:03
Beth: Did any of you guys have a chance to get to the store? 23:05
Stephen: No, no, no. We're good. We got takeout. George: Yeah. 23:08
Beth: No, I-I didn't mean for you. I meant... Devon: All right. 23:10
Jono: What's really funny is these aren't actors. They're just guys on the crew. 23:13
Devon: Are you kidding me? Jono: They just turned the camera towards them. 23:18
Alan: Dude, if those guys were on my film crew, they'd be so fired. 23:22
Jono: Listen, I'm not a woman, but this shot pulling in, of him doing the dishes 23:25
and the kitchen is clean. I'm sitting here. I'm like, that's hot. 23:29
I guess I'm not a woman or gay, but I still am like, Ben Affleck, mmm. 23:33
Neil: Laundry, I'm gonna put away. 23:37
And then another load of clothes in the dryer. 23:38
I did get some of the food your dad likes, 23:43
but I got some healthy stuff, too. 23:44
Alan: I feel things. 23:46
Jono: He got... He's doing the laundry. He's doing the dishes. 23:47
He went grocery shopping. 23:49
Neil: It's gonna be okay. 23:51
Alan: This is after she's split up with him because she wants the thing he doesn't want. Jono: Yeah. 23:52
Jono: And what I love about this scene. This is legitimately beautiful. 23:56
This is one of the few moments in this movie that I'm like, No notes. That's... That's lovely. 24:00
Jono: Is... he's not doing this to get back together with her. Alan: No. 24:04
Jono: He's doing this because he loves her. 24:08
And he knows that she's surrounded by D-bags, who... 24:10
She's probably overworked, she's stressed, and she's grieving, 24:14
Jono: because she doesn't know if her dad's going to live or not. Alan: Right. 24:17
Jono: And he just shows up to help. 24:20
She could still say, Thank you, this means the world to me. 24:22
I don't want to get back together. 24:24
Jono: And he'd be like, That's fine. That's not why I came. Alan: Right. 24:26
Jono: You know, and that's love. That's... that's... 24:28
Jono: We're actually seeing what love is. Alan: That is the action of love. 24:31
Jono: Right. 24:34
Alan: Because love as a concept is this froofy thing 24:35
that the movie spends a ton of time talking about. 24:38
What love actually is, is doing it. 24:40
Jono: And it's caring about the other person's comfort and their happiness without... 24:43
It's not without thought of your own, but without expectation. 24:47
Like, I'm not doing this for any other reason than because I care. 24:50
Beth: Our life together is what I want. 24:55
I miss it. I miss you. 24:58
You see those guys my sisters are married to. 25:01
You are more of a husband to me not being married 25:04
than those real husbands are ever going to be. 25:06
And it's enough. It's really enough for me. 25:08
Neil: And you would be willing to take the whole... 25:16
marriage thing off the table completely. 25:21
Alan: But let's discuss the... Jono: We will. 25:23
Alan: ...the tax implications. Jono: Oh, gosh. 25:24
Alan: Because we're just paying more in taxes. 25:27
Neil: Okay. All right. 25:31
But I've loved you for seven years. It's been... 25:32
Neil: Okay. Jono: Let me talk. 25:36
Beth: You have to snake the drain when my hair gets clogged. 25:39
You know that happens. Okay? 25:43
Neil: Okay. 25:45
Beth: And also... 25:47
You have to let me eat those Wheat Thins in bed. 25:51
You gotta... You gotta give me that. 25:52
Neil: It's okay. Fine. Beth: Okay? 25:54
Neil: All right. 25:55
Beth: And, uh... Yeah. 25:58
Neil: Yeah. 26:01
Beth: That's it. Neil: Okay. 26:01
Alan: Honestly, in terms of lists of demands for a relationship, that's not a lot. 26:05
Alan: It's cute. 26:09
Jono: This is the only Bennifer relationship that works. 26:10
Alan: It's the only Bennifer relationship. Maybe these two. 26:12
Jono: Oh my gosh. Alan: They're both single. 26:14
Jono: Okay. I'm sorry. Please cont-- 26:17
Alan: Come on Ben, you've gone through all the other the other Jennifers. 26:18
Jono: [sound of despair] Alan: Anyway... 26:20
Jono: Real love is, What do you want out of life? Alan: Yeah. 26:22
Jono: I want that for you. Alan: Sure. 26:26
Jono: Now, self-love sometimes means that I can't give you what you want 26:28
Jono: because I need to be true to myself as well. Alan: Sure. 26:31
Jono: Because that's... a healthy relationship is not just loving each other. 26:34
It's loving yourselves and making that all work together. 26:37
And what he's been saying this whole time is, I love you, 26:39
I adore you, but I also have to be true to myself. 26:42
Now, so they could have not gotten back together, 26:45
and there would have been love there, and it would have been beautiful, 26:47
and they would have cheered each other on 26:49
to find happiness in life. And that still would have been love. 26:51
I'm in that situation right now. Honestly, that's my situation. 26:54
But she was willing to say, Okay, this thing, 26:58
I'm willing to sacrifice it because I want you. 27:00
And then he comes around at the end 27:04
and does the same thing and they get married. 27:06
Jono: Aww, because Hollywood. Alan: But also... 27:07
Alan: I didn't like it. Jono: You didn't like it? 27:09
Alan: I did not like that. Jono: Yeah. 27:10
Alan: I thought it would have been a lot better 27:12
to have Beth learn and grow and then have Neil... 27:13
Alan: They didn't need to get married. Jono: Yeah. 27:17
Alan: I don't think it added anything to the story aside from, 27:19
like, oh, we love to have a wedding at the end of the movie. 27:22
Jono: I think it shows she's willing to sacrifice. 27:24
He's willing to sacrifice. 27:26
Alan: He gave up his pants already. 27:27
Jono: Okay, well, can't ask a man to do more than that. 27:30
Alan: Not in this economy. 27:33
Jono: Oh my gosh... 27:34
Alan: So, until next time... 27:36
Jono: You told me that I was the rule, not the exception. 27:38
Alan: You're my exception. 27:41
Internet Dads: And... watch movies. 27:46
Alan: We wanted to thank our Patrons for supporting this episode 27:51
and all of our other ones. 27:54
And also getting things, like extended Director's Cuts, 27:55
this one's pretty long, and all the other stuff you get on Patreon, 27:56
deep dives, all kinds of... 28:00
Jono: Like, Alan's own romantic comedy that he directed 28:01
is going to show up on that Patreon. So check it out. 28:04
It's gonna be better than this one. We hope. 28:07
Folks like... 28:08
Alan: Oh, I did make a romantic comedy. That's right, I forgot. 28:10
Uh, Robot Shark. 28:12
Jono: emily madera. 28:14
Alan: Jazmine Herrera. 28:15
Jono: Dani. 28:16
Alan: And Danielle Koren. 28:17
Jono: Happy Valentine's Day, everybody. 28:19
Alan: We love you. 28:21
But not that way. 28:22
But maybe. 28:23
Jono: No. Definitely not. Alan: Definitely not. 28:24
Jono: But... Yes. Alan: But maybe. 28:26
Jono: No. Gosh dang it. 28:27
Ben: Did you just say "dry hump"? 28:32
Anna: Yeah. 28:35

– English Lyrics

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[English]
Alan: This episode is sponsored by Squarespace.
The all-in-one platform to build a beautiful website and brand.
Ben: I mean, am I not allowed to be friends with people that are hot? I mean...
Jono: Are you 12?
Ben: I have to actively stop my brain from thinking about you.
Jono: Are you a decent human being or not?
Alan: It's bad. Really really bad. But hey, the people are pretty.
Connor: You are sexy. Very sexy.
And... cute.
Jono: Horrible, for everybody involved.
Janine: Aren't we gonna... deal with this?
Alan: Love as a concept is this froofy thing
that the movie spends a ton of time talking about?
What love actually is, is doing it.
Jono: Caring about the other person's comfort and their happiness without expectation.
Alex: You are my exception.
Jono: That's love.
They make valid points, but there are some things
that get under my skin that I have to address right out of the gate.
Alan: Whoa! Hang on. You're blowing my mind.
Alan: Hello, and welcome to Cinema Therapy.
I'm Alan Seawright, a professional filmmaker who needs therapy.
That guy is not me. His name is...
Jono: Jonathan Decker, licensed therapist who is not Alan and loves movies.
Alan: Both of those things are true.
Jono: Speaking of which, what are we doing today?
Alan: I'm just gonna have you rank all the relationships in one movie. Jono: What movie?
Alan: They're all great. He's just not that into you.
So you're gonna be ranking them from exceptional to perfect.
Jono: Oh my gosh...
He's Just Not That Into You is also a reference
to how Alan feels about this movie.
Alan: He isn't.
Jono: All these relationships are terrible,
Jono: except for maybe one and a half of them. Alan: Okay.
Jono: But let's talk about why,
and what we can learn from this dumpster fire.
Alan: Who would you rank the absolute worst?
I know exactly who it is, but go ahead and say it.
Jono: It's Anna and Ben.
Alan: Of course it [beeping] is.
Jono: Because we're romanticizing adultery.
Actually, the movie's not.
But they are, and it goes really bad for them.
Ben: I mean, am I not allowed to be friends with people that are hot?
I mean, look, I mean...
Jono: Oh, yeah, that's innocent.
That's not... blatantly obvious and icky.
Anna: I mean... Jono: Icky goo.
Anna: ...am I not supposed to be friends with a guy
Anna: just because he's married? Ben: Right.
Anna: Or has an insane smile?
Or an ass that makes me want to dry hump?
Jono: Uh, well, because he's married, you probably shouldn't say that. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: You could be friends. You can't say that.
Alan: You probably shouldn't say that.
Like, you write that in the first draft of a script,
and then you write something better.
Ben: I think I just fell in love.
Jono: Ugh, so painful to watch. "I think I just fell in love". No. Anna: We're friends.
Jono: You both think of love like 13 year olds do.
You're using words like "dry hump".
Jono: Okay, so she's gonna skinny dip.
Alan: Sure. Jono: With her ffff...
Alan: As one does. With friends. Jono: We're friends.
Alan: Who make you want to dry hump their ass.
Jono: I don't know... Alan: I don't get it!
I don't understand the words you wrote.
Alan: They don't make sense. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: And look, I'm not kink shaming.
If dry humping asses is your thing...
You know, consenting adults. Fine. Great.
[Beep] this, I don't care.
Jono: He's married. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: She knows he's married. So, honor that.
Respect that, he's in a relationship.
So, you find him attractive, you like his eyes,
his butt makes you want to go woo woo woo woo.
Doesn't matter. Because are you a decent human being or not?
You don't go after someone who's in a relationship.
Jono: You respect that boundary. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: [exasperated sigh] And then he just sees her,
And even though he's committed to his wife and they're...
Supposed to be committed to his wife,
and they're remodeling a house together and planning a future together,
he literally just throws it away because she's pretty.
This other woman is pretty.
And he's like, am I not supposed to have friends with people who are hot?
Like, come on, are you 12?
Are you 12 and this is the lunch line?
Jono: Is this Big. This is a 12 year old boy in a man's body. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: It's not as good as Big.
It's like Big, if you got it from Temu.
And she is going for this. Why? Why? Is it lack of confidence?
Is it lack of self-worth that she's just gonna say, Well,
this guy likes me, and I think he's cute,
and he's charming and he's married, but that's fine.
They start talking about all these stories
of people who fell in love when someone else was married,
and they broke up the marriage and they got together,
but they were soulmates.
You want to know how often that happens?
Like 0.01% of the time.
Alan: I mean, the statistics on that, literally, you can look up the statistics.
They're abysmal.
Jono: Yeah, it's not exactly what I said, but... Alan: It never works.
Jono: Relationships that are based on
one partner betraying their current partner
to be with a new partner are already built on a foundation of lies,
and you know that the person you're with
is willing to cheat on someone that they're with.
Alan: Listen, if dude is going to cheat on his wife of whatever it is,
10 or 15 years, with you because you're the hotter, younger model,
what the [beep] do you think is going to happen to you in 10 years?
Jono: If she's going to go after someone who's married,
what does that say about her sense of commitment
and what that actually is? None of this works.
Alan: Nope. It's bad. It's really, really bad. But, hey, the people are pretty.
And scene.
Jono: It's the new car thing. It's the grass is greener thing.
You have a relationship. You have a commitment.
You have a life with somebody.
Jono: You commit to it and you work it out. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: Or you commit to it, try to work it out,
realize that it's not going to work,
and close that loop before you start something else.
Alan: But have you driven a new car?
[dial tone]
WHAAAT???
Fine, fine, fine. I'm cool. I'm fine.
Jono: My issue is not that these characters are attracted to each other
or drawn to each other.
My issue is that they just feel these feelings and they go, Okay.
Alan: No, look, if this was a relationship between, you know,
Alan: two consenting adults who weren't in previous relationships, it's cute. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: Sure. Fine. Whatever. I mean, the dialog is still wretched,
but you forgive it because pretty.
Jono: But I will give the film credit for this.
Jono: The movie itself is not romanticizing this. Alan: True.
Jono: It is showing you what they think and feel,
and then they show you how it goes horrible for everybody involved.
And so props for that at least.
Jono: Have you seen our Cinema Therapy website?
Alan: It was so easy to build and customize using... Squarespace.
Jono: Squarespace has tons of templates and layouts to choose from
with their guided design system, Squarespace Blueprint AI.
Alan: So once we found one that really worked well
as a starting point for us...
Jono: It was so easy to customize.
Alan: Way easier than navigating the complicated world of dating.
Jono: Tell me about it...
Internet Dads: Wah wah...
Jono: They have built-in visual design tools
that we could make it our own unique brand and style.
Alan: Like Jennifer Connelly
remaking her home into a beautiful palace.
While Bradley Cooper...
...dilly dallies.
Jono: You can connect your social and multimedia accounts...
Alan: So that your website can function as a hub for everything you do.
Jono: Like how ours is linked to YouTube...
Alan: Patreon...
Jono: Our merch stores...
Alan: And other things also. More things.
Jono: They also make it easy to sell content on your website.
Alan: Like courses, blogs, videos.
Jono: And Squarespace Payments is the easiest place
to manage your payments, all in one place.
Alan: So whether you need to build a website for your swanky hipster bar.
Jono: Or your dating tips courses.
Alan: Or to promote your home renovation services.
Jono: Squarespace will work for you and you won't have to spend months
building a new website.
Alan: Check out Squarespace.com for a free trial
and when you're ready to launch...
Jono: Go to Squarespace.com/CinemaTherapy
and use the code CINEMATHERAPY
to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.
Jono: Only slightly better is Anna and Connor.
Alan: Oh, really? I would... Okay.
Jono: But Anna is in the bottom two relationships here
because Anna is terrible.
ScarJo is fantastic. Anna is terrible.
Connor: Hey. Anna: Hey.
Connor: I'm psyched you called. Anna: Cool.
Connor: Kinda given up on you when you didn't call me back the other night.
Anna: Oh, no. I was just thinking about you.
Jono: Why would you say that?
Connor: Okay, what were the categories...
Alan: To manipulate.
Anna: ...or category.
Jono: This is why she's terrible.
Anna: Sexy, funny, and...
Jono: She knows she's leading him on. She knows they slept together once.
He wants nothing more than to be her man.
Anna: ...Parker would be funny.
Jono: And he is safe, and easy, and there
and emotionally supportive, and will rub her feet.
Anna: Oh, what am I?
Connor: Oh, wait. What was I again?
Anna: You're smart and cute.
Connor: Okay. You are sexy. Very sexy. And...
Jono: And he's... And he's flattering.
And he makes her feel good. And he builds her up.
Alan: He's also a moron. Sexy and cute.
Anna: ...all in one column.
Jono: No, that happens.
Connor: Like a jackass if I say...
Alan: Yeah, but if those are the only two defining traits.
Jono: Oh, no. Yeah, okay.
I thought you meant that a person can't be both.
But yeah, if he's saying these are your two defining traits.
Alan: No, person can be both cute and sexy. That's fine.
But if those are your two defining traits, then...
Jono: He's not a moron. Those are her only traits as a character. Alan: Oh, [beep]. You're right.
Jono: She's not smart and she's not decent.
Alan: So he is a moron.
But he's a moron for having feelings for a person he accurately described.
Jono: Yes. Alan: Okay.
Anna: ...totally, totally fried. Is that okay?
Connor: Yeah.
Jono: Why are you kissing him?!
Anna: I'll see you later.
Jono: You're into this married guy, but you've got this...
Internet Dads: Sidepiece.
Jono: Over here, and then you're gonna.. Alan: That look.
Jono: That look was pretty good.
Alan: Oh, man. Kevin Connolly.
They didn't give him much to do,
but he made the most of it with that look.
Alan: That look right there was his whole paycheck.
Jono: Yeah. Alan: It was great.
Jono: He nailed it. Well, listen, and I want to be very clear on something.
We're having a good time taking the piss out of this movie
and these relationships.
Neither of us were any smarter in our 20s.
Alan: No, no, no. Jono: Okay, so I'm not... This isn't us on our high horse.
Alan: Well, I never cheated in my 20s.
Jono: No, but as far as, like, going after somebody who was...
Clearly, you were way more invested in them than... than they were in you.
Alan: No, I did this... a lot.
Jono: Like, this relationship right here. I... That was my entire collegiate career.
Jono: That was my entire... Alan: I witnessed three of those.
Jono: You did witness three of those.
Alan: And it was... very sad. Jono: It was so sad.
Alan: I was... I kept waiting for the Kevin Connolly turn
and look at camera. And I never got it from you.
And I was like, Jono, turn to look at camera, buddy.
- How do you feel right now?
- I feel cocked.
- Do you fe-- Okay.
Jono: Meanwhile, like an idiot. Like this guy,
there were actually plenty of wonderful women
who were interested in me.
Maybe not plenty, but there were more than one.
Alan: Oh, it was plenty. Jono: Okay.
Jono: Thank you. Alan: I've got figures.
Jono: There were any number of actually would have been a great relationship.
And I, like a dummy, just wanted the whole forbidden fruit thing
or the want what you can't have. I don't even know why I was that way.
And I'm a psychoanalyst.
Maybe because I don't want to look in those dark corners of my mind.
Maybe I'm scared to go there. That's probably why I don't know.
Jono: I could discover it. I just don't want to. Alan: I just won't.
- Oh, yeah. The vault. That's where the stuff I can't handle goes.
Jono: But she uses him and he lets her.
And he knows he's being used, and she knows he's using him.
And you would say, Well, in that case, it's all mutual consent.
Yeah, but they're all consenting to something just objectively mean
and cruel and selfish and horrible.
Alan: If you're consenting to stupidity, it doesn't make you smart.
Jono: It just makes you a willing idiot.
Alan: But also, I would argue Connor is not fully consenting.
He doesn't have the entire context.
He doesn't know that she was just coming from essentially a rejection. And...
Jono: She needs comfort.
Alan: She needs comfort and to feel, like, she's desired and and loved by this guy.
Jono: So you're saying he's not consenting to being used
because he doesn't realize that's what's going on?
Alan: Correct. He doesn't realize the extent to which he's being used.
He's consenting to a small part of it, but not the whole enchilada.
Jono: So Connor is smart, but not when it comes to her. Alan: Correct.
Jono: Yeah. And that's why, after she leaves,
the smart part of him comes back and he's like, Wait...
Alan: Wait. I can't smell her anymore. Am I an idiot?
Jono: Number three is Ben and Janine.
Have you noticed that Ben and Anna occupy the bottom three slots on this list?
Alan: Frankly, look, rating them, they're just awful. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: There's a bottom tier, and it's Ben and Anna. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: We shouldn't even be numbering them. Like, they're just awful.
And then we get to rake some other ones.
Ben: I slept with someone.
Jono: You see how the camera changes position? Because it's a change...
Alan: Because there's a change of perspective. Jono: I learned that from you.
Alan: One thing I love about it, though, is the focus stays on her
and he's out of focus in the background.
It makes it about her, which is interesting.
Janine: Are you telling me this in Home Depot because you know I hate a public scene?
Ben: No, that is not why I'm telling you.
Janine: I knew it. I knew it. You a[beep]!
Ben: I'm sorry. I'm s--.
Janine: It is you that's been smoking too, isn't it?
Ben: What? Wait, what does that even matter?
Janine: HAVE YOU...?
Have you been smoking?
Jono: So the reason she's asking this is because in infidelity cases,
Jono: the lies are often as hurtful or more hurtful than the actual cheating. Alan: Sure.
Ben: Look, I talked to Neil. I told him,
and he said I could stay at his boat for a while.
Janine: Excuse me?
Now you're moving out. You're, like, leaving me.
Ben: No, no, I just assumed that you wouldn't want me to...
Janine: Aren't we gonna... deal with this?
Don't you want to find some way for us to work through this?
Ben: I assume that when I told you, you would want me.... out.
Janine: Is that what you want?
Alan: Fun little bit of sound design in the background there.
The lift. Like going eeeghsshh clunk.
Jono: I have to... Ben: No.
Janine: Okay. Okay.
Jono: So one of my areas of specialty in my practice is healing from infidelity.
Helping couples heal from infidelity.
And I have to give credit where it's due
to both the screenwriters and the actors.
Jono: The banter before he tells her... Alan: Stupid.
Jono: But from the moment he actually tells her, that whole conversation feels like...
Alan: Oh, it's... Jono: It's very real.
Alan: It's awesome. These are two really talented actors,
given an okay version of that, as a script,
and they're crushing it.
Jono: But this, this scene does feel very real, from him... Alan: Yeah.
Jono: Him saying it and her saying, Are you telling me now
because you don't want to make a scene?
And he says, No, it's just like this was the moment because of what you said.
Like, I couldn't bear it anymore to not tell you.
And then when she says, It is you who's smoking.
It seems like a stupid thing to pivot to.
Why aren't we talking about the affair? Why are you bringing up smoking?
It's not a stupid thing.
It all comes back to, What are you lying to me about?
Since this is out in the open, let's get it all on the table.
Because I want to know where I'm being deceived
and where the dishonesty is happening.
Alan: Honestly, to me, that's the best bit of screenwriting in the whole movie is,
is her fixation on this little lie
that isn't the biggest deal in the world next to the other stuff, it's fantastic.
Jono: I do like that she's kind of trying to... trying to save the marriage,
but he's insisting that he doesn't smoke
and later, when she finds the cigarettes, is when she's just done.
Alan: That's it. Yeah.
Jono: Because it's not about the smoking, it's about that even with this,
Jono: he's still lying to her. Alan: He's lying.
Jono: And when he says, I'm going to go stay with my buddy on his boat,
and she says, You want to move out? And he says, No,
I just assumed you wouldn't want me there.
And she said, Don't you want to fight for the marriage?
This is the most realistic scene in the movie, so props to them.
But as far as ranking the couple...
No. It's a marriage falling apart because of infidelity and dishonesty.
And I think I'm a bit more sympathetic to Janine than you are.
But I don't think you're attacking the character
as much as the writing anyway.
Alan: I'm attacking the writing and a little bit attacking the character,
but it's mainly just because I'm disappointed
because I love watching Jennifer Connelly be smart.
Jono: Listen, guys, we swear we love Jennifer Connelly.
I know we don't have the best track record with this.
Alan: We'll find a couple of movies to talk about.
Jono: Number two. Alex and Gigi.
This is where I actually start enjoying the couples and the movie.
- Wow, that is delicious. Finally, some good [beeping] food.
Jono: There's some problems here,
but they arrive at a very beautiful, healthy place. Let's take a look.
So he's been her dating coach,
and she thinks he's just trying to get close to her,
which he is, but he doesn't know it.
Alan: He's just not that into you.
Gigi: I knew it. The best relationships grow out of friendships.
Jono: And she's right.
Alex: Wait, wait. Gigi, hey. Wait, wait, wait. What?
Now you and I are in a relationship?
Gigi: Well, I'd say if we're not at relationship station ship,
we're at least on the track.
Alex: And why exactly would you think that?
Gigi: Because of the signs.
Alex: Really? Like what?
Gigi: Like it was good to hear from me.
And you talked to me even when you were with a girl
and... I... felt something?
Alex: What are you talking about, Gigi? What have I been saying since I met you?
If a guy wants to date you, he will make it happen, okay?
He will ask you out. Did I ask you out?
Gigi: No.
Alex: Why would you do this? Oh, [beep].
Why do they even do this? Why do they build up this stuff in their minds?
Take each little thing a guy does and then twist it into something else.
It's insane!
Alan: Okay. What she did was literally insane.
Is it a thing a real person would do?
Jono: Yes. Alan: It... What?
Jono: No, not the pouncing thing, but the building it up in your mind thing. Alan: Oh, wow.
Gigi: ...be like that and be like you.
Alan: This is a fun...
Alex: Excuse me? What is that supposed to mean?
Alan: ...soliloquy that she gets.
Gigi: I may dissect each little thing and put myself out there too much,
but at least that means I still care.
Oh, you think you've won because women are expendable to you.
And you may not get... get hurt or make an ass of yourself that way.
But you don't fall in love that way either.
You have not won. You're alone, Alex.
Alan: True. But have you seen his loft?
Gigi: I may do a lot of stupid [beep],
but I know I'm a lot closer to finding someone than you are.
Jono: Okay. I have thoughts in a lot of different directions
about this scene and this relationship.
Jono: They both make valid points about the other. Alan: Sure.
Jono: But there's some things that get under my skin
that I have to address right out of the gate.
Alan: Go for it.
Jono: When he says, Why do women do this?
I hate lines like that because not all women are the same.
Any more than you can say anything about guys or any...
No... no group is a monolith.
Alan: Whoa! Hang on. You're blowing my mind.
Jono: So this was the great... This was the great struggle
of watching rom coms in the 90s and early 2000, when I was young,
Jono: and I didn't have a master's degree in healthy relationships. Alan: Right.
Jono: Is I would go to romantic comedies for advice on how to date.
♫♫ Oh my God ♫♫
Jono: There, I said it. Alan: We all did. No, we all did.
Jono: Yeah, we all did. Alan: This is how we were raised.
Jono: We were like, what... Exactly.
We're like, What are the rules? Rom coms will teach us.
Alan: Rom coms will teach us.
Jono: I don't know why we're trusting these idiots
who write these things to tell us what love is.
Alan: Listen, if you're trusting William Shakespeare or Jane Austen...
Alan: Go with God. Jono: Yes.
Alan: If you're trusting whoever the [beep] this was...
I don't know. And I don't care.
I don't want to know who this was, because I don't want to respect them less.
Jono: Because you don't want to disrespect real people? Alan: I don't.
Jono: But Abby Kohn and Marc Silverstein, the writers of He's Just Not That Into You,
also gave us Never Been Kissed.
Alan: [Beep] them to hell.
It's also stupid.
That's not how the world works, movie.
Is it ever addressed in the movie
whether or not Drew Barrymore has actually been [beeping] kissed?!
I don't think...
It is. And she has.
What the [beep] are you doing?
Alan: That's it. Jono: Please don't... Um. Just get better at writing.
Jono: I'll soften that a little bit. Alan: Stop writing.
Find something else to do with your lives.
Don't do it anymore.
Jono: I resent when each of them talks about how men and women are.
And I also don't like the implication
Jono: that you have to be with somebody to be happy. Alan: Right.
Jono: She is so much closer to finding someone. But what if she just found herself?
Alan: Also, what if Justin Long is just happy living in an awesome place,
owning a bar and playing, what is it, NCAA football with models.
Seems like a pretty good life. Maybe he's just chill.
Jono: Now here's my... here's my issue with him
Jono: and where she hits the nail on the head when she says, Women are expendable to you. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: There's nothing wrong with if you're somebody who isn't ready for
or, frankly, doesn't want a committed long term relationship,
but you have to be upfront and transparent about that.
Alan: Yeah. If you can find someone else in the same boat.
Jono: Yeah. Or if you're looking f or casual relationships
or casual flings or whatever, but you have to be upfront about it.
And he doesn't do that.
He breaks women's hearts by leading them along,
and then he's giving her the inside track on how he and other guys do this
and how they'll act if they actually are into you.
But there's never really, on his part, an owning
Jono: that I'm kind of being an ass by treating people this way. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: And then on her part, again, what if she found herself first?
She is so fixated on finding love. It is her one... It is Gollum and the ring.
She is hunting for it. She will not stop.
Alan: It's worse than that. She's the freaking skunk from Warner Bros.
Jono: She's Pepe Le Pew? Alan: She's Pepe Le Pew.
Jono: Please don't cancel him, though. He's funny. Uh...
You know, it is not just a kiss of physical attraction.
I admire her mind, too.
Jono: But she is. I mean, this is her one purpose in life is to find love.
And she's very much in a headspace of, Until I do, I can't be happy and satisfied.
That's my critique of both of them. Now, what I really like about this scene
Jono: is the things that they point out in each other are pretty accurate.
Alan: Accurate. Jono: Yeah.
Jono: Here's why I have them at number two.
Jono: We're actually trending more positively towards something healthy. Alan: Okay.
Jono: Is he accepts influence from her. Alan: Yeah.
Jono: And that he engages in perspective taking.
And instead of saying where he started, You're crazy. What's wrong with you?
Like, a week later, he's like, Oh, now I'm crazy.
And I know exactly what was wrong with her
because it's the same thing that's wrong with me.
Jono: And it's called love. Alan: Awww.
Jono: Also accountability kink activated.
He does own his mistakes where he got it wrong
and that he can be better, the ways that he hurt her.
What we don't see him do is the actual work.
Because it's a movie and we don't have the time.
Alan: We don't have the time. And also we have way too many characters.
Jono: Yeah, this is a two hour movie that I really needed as a 15-minute short film.
That's what I needed. Okay.
Alan: I just didn't need it.
Jono: Number one is Beth and Neil.
This is the actual healthy relationship that I love in this movie.
Ben Affleck, Jennifer Aniston, she wants to get married,
he thinks marriage is just a piece of paper.
They break up over that. Her dad has a heart attack.
And her brothers and brothers in law are not pulling their weight and not helping.
Stephen: Dah, dah, dah, dah. Argh!.
Devon: It's so embarrassing.
George: What?
Beth: Did any of you guys have a chance to get to the store?
Stephen: No, no, no. We're good. We got takeout. George: Yeah.
Beth: No, I-I didn't mean for you. I meant... Devon: All right.
Jono: What's really funny is these aren't actors. They're just guys on the crew.
Devon: Are you kidding me? Jono: They just turned the camera towards them.
Alan: Dude, if those guys were on my film crew, they'd be so fired.
Jono: Listen, I'm not a woman, but this shot pulling in, of him doing the dishes
and the kitchen is clean. I'm sitting here. I'm like, that's hot.
I guess I'm not a woman or gay, but I still am like, Ben Affleck, mmm.
Neil: Laundry, I'm gonna put away.
And then another load of clothes in the dryer.
I did get some of the food your dad likes,
but I got some healthy stuff, too.
Alan: I feel things.
Jono: He got... He's doing the laundry. He's doing the dishes.
He went grocery shopping.
Neil: It's gonna be okay.
Alan: This is after she's split up with him because she wants the thing he doesn't want. Jono: Yeah.
Jono: And what I love about this scene. This is legitimately beautiful.
This is one of the few moments in this movie that I'm like, No notes. That's... That's lovely.
Jono: Is... he's not doing this to get back together with her. Alan: No.
Jono: He's doing this because he loves her.
And he knows that she's surrounded by D-bags, who...
She's probably overworked, she's stressed, and she's grieving,
Jono: because she doesn't know if her dad's going to live or not. Alan: Right.
Jono: And he just shows up to help.
She could still say, Thank you, this means the world to me.
I don't want to get back together.
Jono: And he'd be like, That's fine. That's not why I came. Alan: Right.
Jono: You know, and that's love. That's... that's...
Jono: We're actually seeing what love is. Alan: That is the action of love.
Jono: Right.
Alan: Because love as a concept is this froofy thing
that the movie spends a ton of time talking about.
What love actually is, is doing it.
Jono: And it's caring about the other person's comfort and their happiness without...
It's not without thought of your own, but without expectation.
Like, I'm not doing this for any other reason than because I care.
Beth: Our life together is what I want.
I miss it. I miss you.
You see those guys my sisters are married to.
You are more of a husband to me not being married
than those real husbands are ever going to be.
And it's enough. It's really enough for me.
Neil: And you would be willing to take the whole...
marriage thing off the table completely.
Alan: But let's discuss the... Jono: We will.
Alan: ...the tax implications. Jono: Oh, gosh.
Alan: Because we're just paying more in taxes.
Neil: Okay. All right.
But I've loved you for seven years. It's been...
Neil: Okay. Jono: Let me talk.
Beth: You have to snake the drain when my hair gets clogged.
You know that happens. Okay?
Neil: Okay.
Beth: And also...
You have to let me eat those Wheat Thins in bed.
You gotta... You gotta give me that.
Neil: It's okay. Fine. Beth: Okay?
Neil: All right.
Beth: And, uh... Yeah.
Neil: Yeah.
Beth: That's it. Neil: Okay.
Alan: Honestly, in terms of lists of demands for a relationship, that's not a lot.
Alan: It's cute.
Jono: This is the only Bennifer relationship that works.
Alan: It's the only Bennifer relationship. Maybe these two.
Jono: Oh my gosh. Alan: They're both single.
Jono: Okay. I'm sorry. Please cont--
Alan: Come on Ben, you've gone through all the other the other Jennifers.
Jono: [sound of despair] Alan: Anyway...
Jono: Real love is, What do you want out of life? Alan: Yeah.
Jono: I want that for you. Alan: Sure.
Jono: Now, self-love sometimes means that I can't give you what you want
Jono: because I need to be true to myself as well. Alan: Sure.
Jono: Because that's... a healthy relationship is not just loving each other.
It's loving yourselves and making that all work together.
And what he's been saying this whole time is, I love you,
I adore you, but I also have to be true to myself.
Now, so they could have not gotten back together,
and there would have been love there, and it would have been beautiful,
and they would have cheered each other on
to find happiness in life. And that still would have been love.
I'm in that situation right now. Honestly, that's my situation.
But she was willing to say, Okay, this thing,
I'm willing to sacrifice it because I want you.
And then he comes around at the end
and does the same thing and they get married.
Jono: Aww, because Hollywood. Alan: But also...
Alan: I didn't like it. Jono: You didn't like it?
Alan: I did not like that. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: I thought it would have been a lot better
to have Beth learn and grow and then have Neil...
Alan: They didn't need to get married. Jono: Yeah.
Alan: I don't think it added anything to the story aside from,
like, oh, we love to have a wedding at the end of the movie.
Jono: I think it shows she's willing to sacrifice.
He's willing to sacrifice.
Alan: He gave up his pants already.
Jono: Okay, well, can't ask a man to do more than that.
Alan: Not in this economy.
Jono: Oh my gosh...
Alan: So, until next time...
Jono: You told me that I was the rule, not the exception.
Alan: You're my exception.
Internet Dads: And... watch movies.
Alan: We wanted to thank our Patrons for supporting this episode
and all of our other ones.
And also getting things, like extended Director's Cuts,
this one's pretty long, and all the other stuff you get on Patreon,
deep dives, all kinds of...
Jono: Like, Alan's own romantic comedy that he directed
is going to show up on that Patreon. So check it out.
It's gonna be better than this one. We hope.
Folks like...
Alan: Oh, I did make a romantic comedy. That's right, I forgot.
Uh, Robot Shark.
Jono: emily madera.
Alan: Jazmine Herrera.
Jono: Dani.
Alan: And Danielle Koren.
Jono: Happy Valentine's Day, everybody.
Alan: We love you.
But not that way.
But maybe.
Jono: No. Definitely not. Alan: Definitely not.
Jono: But... Yes. Alan: But maybe.
Jono: No. Gosh dang it.
Ben: Did you just say "dry hump"?
Anna: Yeah.

Key Vocabulary

Start Practicing
Vocabulary Meanings

think

/θɪŋk/

A1
  • verb
  • - to use the mind to consider or reason about something
  • verb
  • - to believe or consider something to be true

love

/lʌv/

A1
  • noun
  • - a strong feeling of affection
  • verb
  • - to have a deep affection for someone or something

friend

/frɛnd/

A1
  • noun
  • - a person with whom one has a bond of mutual affection, loyalty, and support

hot

/hɑt/

A2
  • adjective
  • - having a high temperature or very warm
  • adjective
  • - attractive or sexually appealing

married

/ˈmærid/

A2
  • adjective
  • - having a spouse or legally united in marriage

want

/wɑnt/

A1
  • verb
  • - to desire or wish for something

relationship

/rɪˈleɪʃənˌʃɪp/

A2
  • noun
  • - the way in which two or more people or things are connected

feel

/fil/

A1
  • verb
  • - to become aware of something by touching it or experiencing it
  • verb
  • - to have an emotional response

cheat

/tʃit/

B1
  • verb
  • - to deceive or trick someone, especially in a relationship

affair

/əˈfɛr/

B1
  • noun
  • - a secret sexual relationship, especially between a married person and someone else

consent

/kənˈsɛnt/

B1
  • noun
  • - permission or agreement, especially in a sexual context

attractive

/əˈtræktɪv/

B1
  • adjective
  • - pleasing to the eye or mind

care

/kɛr/

A2
  • noun
  • - the provision of what is necessary for the health, welfare, maintenance, and protection of someone or something
  • verb
  • - to feel concern or interest

commitment

/kəˈmɪtmənt/

B1
  • noun
  • - the state or quality of being dedicated to a cause, activity, or relationship

beautiful

/ˈbjutəfəl/

A2
  • adjective
  • - pleasing to the senses or mind as regards beauty

decent

/ˈdisənt/

B1
  • adjective
  • - conforming with generally accepted standards of respectable or moral behavior

human

/ˈhjumən/

A2
  • adjective
  • - relating to people
  • noun
  • - a person

brain

/breɪn/

A2
  • noun
  • - the organ inside the head that controls thoughts, memories, and bodily functions

thing

/θɪŋ/

A1
  • noun
  • - an object or matter

concept

/ˈkɑnsɛpt/

B1
  • noun
  • - an abstract idea or general notion

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Key Grammar Structures

  • If a guy wants to date you, he will make it happen, okay?

    ➔ First Conditional

    ➔ The "First Conditional" describes a real or very likely situation in the future. Here, "if a guy wants..." expresses a general truth with the result "he will make it happen."

  • She's fixated on finding love.

    ➔ Gerund after preposition

    ➔ The "gerund" "finding" follows the preposition "on", forming a phrase that acts as the object of "fixated." This structure is common in expressions like "be fixated on doing something."

  • I've loved you for seven years.

    ➔ Present Perfect Simple

    ➔ The "Present Perfect Simple" connects past actions with the present. "I've loved" indicates an action that started in the past ("for seven years") and continues or has relevance now.

  • You have to let me eat those Wheat Thins in bed.

    ➔ Modal Verb 'Have to' for Obligation

    ➔ The modal verb "have to" expresses obligation or necessity. Here, it means the speaker requires or insists that the listener allow her to "eat those Wheat Thins."

  • This is the actual healthy relationship that I love in this movie.

    ➔ Relative Clause

    ➔ A "relative clause" provides more information about a noun. "That I love in this movie" describes "the actual healthy relationship," using the relative pronoun "that."

  • It's not romanticizing adultery.

    ➔ Passive Voice

    ➔ In "passive voice," the subject receives the action. Here, "adultery" is not being treated by the movie as something appealing; the focus is on the action ("romanticizing") done to it.

  • He's doing this because he loves her.

    ➔ Infinitive of Purpose

    ➔ The "infinitive of purpose" ("to...") explains why an action happens. "He's doing this to help" implies the purpose is "to help," but here it's implied by the clause "because he loves her." Note: this example uses "because" for clarity.

  • I have to actively stop my brain from thinking about you.

    ➔ Gerund as Object

    ➔ The "gerund" "thinking" acts as the object of the preposition "from," and modifies "stop." It represents the verb "to think" in noun form.

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