[English]
Over the past 5 years, social media has
gone through one of the most dramatic
transformations since it began. The
platforms that once promised connection,
community, and a voice for everyone have
devolved into something much more
harmful. Viral stunts, immature pranks,
choreographed dances. Also, heightened
levels of anxiety, depression, and the
disruption of the very fabric of
society. I want to explore why social
media has gotten so much worse recently
and the quiet but growing rebellion
against it that has the very architects
of the system on edge. This video is
sponsored by Headspace. More about them
later. So, I think we can learn a lot
about the problems with social media
today by looking at how Instagram
promotes its own app. If you go to the
login page, it says sign up to see
photos and videos from your friends.
What a load of Anyone that uses
Instagram knows this just isn't true and
is far from the content machine it's
become. But it does give us a clue into
the challenges this company and every
social media platform is facing today
and why the distance is growing between
what people want and what they're
getting. Jack Ki, the co-founder and CEO
of Patreon, has spent years thinking
about the economics of the internet and
has seen from the front lines just how
drastically social media has changed
since it was first introduced.
>> Jack, thank you so much for being here.
Question number one, what the happened
to Instagram?
>> Oh man, what I love that question? Uh,
okay,
here's what happened. Web two sort of
emerged in like 2005. Web two companies
were like Instagram, Facebook, YouTube.
The amazing thing about web 2 was you
could like subscribe to a creator. You
could follow them and then you would see
the rest of their work as it came to you
in the future. This was a new thing.
Before web 2, the internet was mostly
read only. Like you log in via AOL or
something and you you like can just like
read the news. But the the amazing thing
about web two was for the first time
like people could upload, they could
share, they could like broadcast their
ideas and the like the most profound
piece of internet architecture came out
at that time uh you know that came out
at the time was was this thing called
the follow.
>> As Jack explained it, the follow gave
you the power. You decided who you
liked, who you wanted to hear from, and
who you wanted to fill your feed. It
felt like your corner of the internet, a
personalized space built around real
connections and genuine interests. I
only subscribe to people and watch
videos that make me happy, inspire me,
make me feel positive, uplift me.
>> But that version of social media didn't
last. The idealistic vision was great
for users, but not for investors. Once
these platforms went public, they faced
a new challenge. How do you turn
connection into profit? We all know what
happened next. Social platforms started
to run ads and ads made them a lot of
money. So, they scaled the model. Grow
larger. Show more ads. Get more users.
Show more ads. Hold users attention for
longer. Show more ads. Get more data on
who your customer is, their hopes,
fears, and dreams. Sell more expensive
ads. The customer of Facebook is the
advertiser. And what the advertiser
wants from consumers is attention. And
what Facebook has built is a machine
that converts
attention into revenue. That is the
Facebook machine. Everything about the
financial system is set up to hold
Facebook accountable for revenue growth.
What that does is it aims the entire
financial system, hundreds of years of
financial infrastructure. It aims that
entire system of accountability and
discipline at sucking attention away
from humanity. That's the problem. That
is the problem.
>> You say these things like they are my
fault and yet they are not. Well, you
did create a platform with a monetary
incentive for people to spread
misinformation.
[Laughter]
>> Bo Burnham recently summed it up well.
Tech companies aren't satisfied with
just a piece of your time. They want it
all. They are now trying to colonize
every minute of your life. That is what
these people are trying to do. Every
single free moment you have is a moment
you could be looking at your phone and
they could be gathering information to
target ads at you. that that's what's
happening.
>> When the biggest tech companies in the
world are competing for your attention,
they'll design features that exploit
every human vulnerability they can find.
Even the smallest change can have a
really big impact, like infinite scroll.
No, not a never-ending pastry, something
much more nefarious. Before this feature
existed, websites had pages, natural
breaks that let you decide whether to
keep going or to stop. In 2006,
interface designer Asa Rascin came up
with an idea to replace those breaks
with a neverending feed. What seemed
like a small improvement quickly became
one of the most influential changes in
how we use the internet today. Without a
stopping point and an endless stream of
content, this simple feature can quietly
steal hundreds of hours from your life
every year. Asa himself says he regrets
creating it. I was blind to how it was
going to get picked up and used, not for
people, but against people. And this was
actually a huge lesson for me that me
sitting here optimizing an interface for
one individual is sort of like that's
that's that's that was morally good. But
being blind to how it was going to be
used
globally was sort of globally amoral at
best or maybe even a little immoral. In
a world where apps rise and fall
overnight, the social media giants have
learned to move fast or risk becoming
the next MySpace. When a feature works
on one platform, it doesn't stay there
for long. It's copied, repackaged, and
rolled out everywhere. We've seen this
happen with pretty much every fast
growing app from Snapchat to Be Real and
of course,
>> Tik Tok.
>> Tik Tok.
>> Tik Tok.
>> Tik Tok.
>> Tik Tok explodes in popularity.
>> It's surging in popularity here in the
US.
>> 15-year-old Charlie Dio's new favorite
pastime is making up dance moves for the
social media app Tik Tok. This group of
20 talented content creators is part of
a growing trend of young social media
stars snapping up big real estate so
they can physically be together to make
videos 24/7.
>> We're definitely like the two most
hated. Definitely
>> the most cringiest.
>> Like they're literally call blueberry
cuz their hair is blue.
>> Yeah.
>> And then I'm orange. They're like, "Oh
my god, the orange and the blueberry."
>> What has happened over the last 5 years
is really profound. Tik Tok came onto
the scene and Tik Tok's major innovation
I think people think oh Tik Tok is is
vertical first short form video but
that's not Tik Tok's major innovation I
think that's a red herring what what Tik
Tok did that was truly different and
innovative was Tik Tok said oh you know
these concepts of feeds that people are
using where you have your followers and
you scroll through a feed and you see
people you follow Tik Tok said forget
about following we're going to rebuild
your feed from scratch based on who we
think you're going to the like not who
you've chosen to follow, but what the
platform thinks you will spend time on,
and we're going to optimize it for time
spent. While Tik Tok didn't invent the
algorithmic feed, they did crack the
code on virality. For years, your feed
was shaped by who you chose to follow.
Tik Tok removed that control entirely,
replacing it with a feed that didn't
care about your social graph. Instead,
every scroll was another data point,
teaching the algorithm exactly what you
would keep watching. The most successful
video I had right now was like at 68
million views right now.
>> I'm sorry, 68 million views.
>> Yeah, it's just me like turning into
like a monster.
>> Now, if it had just been Tik Tok that
did that, we all would have just left
Tik Tok and and that would have been the
end of the story. But the thing is it
worked. Um, and by it worked, I mean Tik
Tok built a very addictive
consumer experience that people couldn't
tear themselves out of. And so traffic
sort of siphoned off of Instagram and
Facebook and all the other social apps
and onto Tik Tok. And all the other
social apps saw this
and felt pressure to get traffic back.
And the way that they did that was by
also ditching the follow in their
systems and by building for you feeds.
>> Tik Tok might say that its for you feed
democratized the internet. Suddenly,
anyone could reach millions regardless
of their follower count. And
simultaneously, viewers could discover
creators they'd never heard of. On the
surface, it looks like a win-win. But in
reality, this change had far worse
consequences. In Johan Har's bestselling
book, Stolen Focus, he documents exactly
what went wrong when these platforms
rolled out these kinds of feeds.
>> The algorithm is neutral about the
question of whether it wants you to be
calm or angry. That's not its concern.
It only cares about one thing. Will you
keep scrolling? Unfortunately, there's a
quirk of human behavior. On average, we
will stare at something negative and
outrageous for a lot longer than we will
stare at something positive and calm.
>> Go like this.
>> No, Mom. She's seriously
>> No, I know, but go like this for the
video.
>> Social media has turned into a model
that serves the platforms more than the
creators or the audience. And as a
result, people are starting to turn
against it and they don't have any plans
to come back. So for me, when it comes
to incorporating technology into my
life, it's not about getting off the
grid and living in a cave. It's about
finding balance. I want technology to
add value to my life, to help me find
purpose, meaning, get clarity, and help
quiet those late night thoughts about
the rise of fascism, the collapse of the
global economy, and the possibility that
this country might be run by lizard
people. That's where my sponsor,
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Probably shouldn't call you guys idiots.
It's not good form.
It's really easy to romanticize the
past. Social media was never this
perfect beacon of civilization. Early
on, it gave us internet stalking,
endless cringe, and yeah, a couple
beheading videos. But it's gotten
objectively worse. Even as we see an
explosion of creativity with independent
creators producing thoughtful,
hilarious, and inspiring work, these
voices are often getting drowned out by
professional grifters, fast-moving
trends, high production clickbait, and
AI generated content, most of which are
surfacing above the people that we chose
to follow in the first place. What was
once pitched as a town square now feels
more like reality TV on crack. Meta
itself admitted during the FTC trial
recently that just 7% of time spent on
Instagram in 2025 is spent viewing
content from friends. I think social
media has become less social like it's
more about just consuming this kind of
highly commodified content and it's more
about lifestyle aspiration things that
you are moving toward in your own life
not just like what's going on around you
and how are you relating to your friends
and family. I mean to me that kind of
removes the purpose of social media.
This trend of pushing viral content over
personal connections has led to more
profit in the short term. But there's a
huge problem. Even though the usage
numbers are still high, public sentiment
is turning against Tik Tok and
Instagram. People are starting to hate
it.
>> I've been in a few dark places in my
life and a lot of it was influenced by
social comparison of social media.
>> I was getting to the point with social
media where I felt completely detached
from reality. I was more irritated with
my daughter. I was comparing my marriage
to other people's marriage. I felt more
insecure about my face, my hair, my
body.
>> According to a recent poll, twothirds of
16 to 24 year olds think social media
does more harm than good. Plus, half
think that they spent too much time on
it when they were younger. As journalist
Gabby Hinsliff wrote, "This isn't how
someone talks about something they love,
but how you look back on a relationship
that was in retrospect making you
miserable." There's a fundamental
mismatch between the way our brains are
wired and this behavior of exposing
yourself to stimuli with intermittent
rewards throughout all of your waking
hours. So, it's one thing to spend a
couple hours at the slot machine in Las
Vegas, but if you bring a slot machine
with you and you pull that handle all
day long from when you wake up to when
you go to bed, we're not wired from it.
It shortcircuits the brain. And we're
starting to find that it has actual
cognitive consequences. One of them
being the sort of pervasive background
hum of anxiety. I don't understand how
the current model even works. Like, it
doesn't make sense to me because I speak
to very few people that say, "Oh, I love
Instagram. Oh, it's a joy. I open up
Instagram every day and just like it's a
blast scrolling through." How does this
all work? Like, why are people using
these platforms if they're making them
miserable? There is a difference between
what we value
and what we attend to.
That is the core of the pain we're
feeling. is that we will pay attention
to lots of things that aren't important
to us, that don't bring our lives
meaning and joy, that don't better us
over the long term, that don't enable
and help our brains and psyches and make
us feel good and strong and better.
We'll pay attention to all kinds of [ __ ]
that is not good for us. I know what the
[ __ ] is going on. I work at Patreon. I
work at a tech company. I've seen these
systems from the inside.
I personally had to set a time limit on
Instagram on my phone to stop myself
from going. I had to set a 10-minute
time limit. And I I do that now. And I
don't give myself more than 10 minutes.
Like, I had to draw a hard line because
these systems are so powerful. I
remember when I did my first social
media detox back in 2018. I quit all the
apps for 30 days. At the time, this was
still considered pretty new, if not
socially unacceptable. You really felt
like you were going to miss out on what
your friends were up to. It's different
now. Now, you're only missing out on
some viral trends and a quick hit of
dopamine. Digital detoxes and social
media cleanses aren't fringe anymore.
They're everywhere. Minimalist phones
and dumb apps are getting more and more
popular. Concerts and venues are asking
people to put their phones in bags or
cover their cameras with stickers to
encourage people to be more present. Put
your phones away.
>> In real life, organizations and groups
like the offline club are popping up
everywhere, encouraging people to ditch
their phones and meet in person. And a
lot more people, myself included, are
going one step further and deleting
these apps outright.
>> I want to get my life back. And I feel
like the only way to do this is to break
up with the internet.
>> I've decided to basically quit social
media.
>> No Instagram, no Tik Tok, no Twitter,
nothing. I don't have social media. I'm
better than you. I'm frolicking in the
woods, scavenging ingredients to make my
life whole.
>> The growing push back and the rising
dissatisfaction among users is a serious
problem for social platforms. None of
them want people to dislike or regret
their experience, but they can't help
themselves. They're caught between
satisfying users and generating profit.
And within a system built for endless
growth, their choice is always going to
be for the latter. the one thing that
might stop them is if this push back
grows enough to hurt their bottom line.
>> That it's already part of the public
consciousness and the public
conversation. So it seems to me that
we're in this pivotal moment for
for for humans right now. If I really
step back, I I actually have a lot of
hope. And I have hope because humanity's
only been trying to figure this out for
two decades. Like the internet is brand
new and and it's it's pervasive and
dramatic and it represents a massive
change for human communication and
organization. It's going to take humans
a little while to figure that out.
Thanks so much to Jack for sitting down
to chat with me for this video. Check
out the links in the description to
learn more about what he's up to. And
thanks again to Headspace. Don't forget
to grab 60 days free with my link
headspace.com/mattella.
Thanks for watching and see you next