Why did you connect with California? I
00:01
mean, you could have gone to an airport
00:04
and handpicked anywhere in the world and
00:05
started to some degree again, but you
00:08
chose to come here.
00:10
For me, honestly, I think like so many
00:15
of my close friends are here,
00:18
people from London who've moved here for
00:20
work and stuff like that. It's like I'd
00:23
say since I left home I have I've never
00:25
really had the place that feels like oh
00:27
that's that's my home. I'd say my house
00:31
in London is the most homely
00:34
um that I feel anywhere. Um just cuz
00:37
I've been there the longest. I've been
00:41
there for like 6 years now
00:42
with like all the touring and stuff that
00:45
we did in the band. I remember there was
00:46
one point where we'd been away for so
00:48
long that I came home to my house in
00:51
England
00:54
and I was home for about 5 days and I
00:56
walked in the door and I sat down and I
00:59
was like
01:02
I I don't know what to do like when I'm
01:03
home at all. I'd been away for so long.
01:05
I didn't you know I hadn't seen my
01:08
friends for so long. I was I didn't know
01:10
who was around. I was kind of like who
01:12
do I
01:15
what is this strange reality? Yeah. So
01:15
there was a point, I guess, where I
01:17
realized I was more comfortable being on
01:18
the road than
01:20
What did you do after 5 days? Did you
01:21
hear back off again?
01:22
Yeah. And I was like happy to to go, you
01:24
know.
01:27
I think it's actually understandable. I
01:27
think there's something about that kind
01:29
of gypsy lifestyle which in particular
01:30
the arts that make travel music and such
01:32
and the idea of having sort of a a
01:34
desire to be gypsy just but by by your
01:36
very nature they attracted one another
01:38
to some degree. I mean do were you
01:39
always a little bit kind of adventurous
01:40
as a kid? Were you looking further a
01:42
field even when you were growing? Um, I
01:43
don't know if I was really. I I had
01:45
never been to London before I moved
01:48
there, which is crazy to me to think
01:49
about it now.
01:53
That is crazy.
01:53
You know, it's not that far away from
01:54
where I grew up. It's like a 3-hour
01:56
drive, but London was like where
01:58
the rich kids went shopping on the
02:01
weekend, like with their with their mom
02:04
or something, you know? But also
02:05
everything about it felt felt like it
02:07
was like this is a new challenge and if
02:11
it takes me to London then the whole
02:13
thing seemed to me to just be a new
02:16
challenge. It was crazy watching it kind
02:18
of from a distance and
02:20
watching what you and your friends were
02:22
kind of going through and and the whole
02:23
thing I mean I suppose with the benefit
02:25
of some of some wisdom and some age now
02:26
looking back on it you must even have a
02:28
slightly different perspective than when
02:30
it first ended in 2015. It's been 4
02:31
years and just kind of thinking what
02:33
happened.
02:36
Yeah, it's pretty cra it's pretty crazy
02:37
now cuz there'll be times where people
02:39
will remind me of stuff that happened
02:41
that I forgot about
02:43
and you like relive it all over again
02:45
and you're kind of like, "Oh, yeah, that
02:47
was cool. That was cool, too." You know,
02:48
the first two years you don't even feel
02:51
like you're working at all cuz you're
02:52
just so happy to not be going to school
02:55
and it it's like, "Oh, I get to do this.
02:58
Great. Okay. Um, and you kind of go from
03:02
also like, you know, when you're a kid
03:05
and you like you see a t-shirt that you
03:07
want and you like save up the exact
03:09
amount.
03:11
Yeah.
03:12
But you'd have to account for like the
03:12
postage and packaging. So, you'd
03:14
actually have to like save up for this
03:15
amount. You know, you're kind of like
03:17
doing this and then you move to London
03:20
and you work doing stuff that's fun and
03:23
you're like, can I buy this t-shirt? And
03:25
someone's like, uh, yeah, if you want.
03:27
You're like, okay.
03:29
And that kind of feels like what life is
03:31
like.
03:33
Yeah. Then it just goes from t-shirt to
03:34
to flat, from flat to house to if you
03:36
know, you're lucky enough to to to have
03:38
that kind of success. I mean, I'm
03:40
interested to know two memories and
03:43
we're not going to stick around here for
03:45
long cuz there's so much more to talk
03:46
about. But while we're here, what was
03:47
now you've been away from that
03:51
experience, what's the the strongest
03:52
prevailing memory you have before One
03:54
Direction started? Like what can what's
03:57
the sharpest most vivid memory you have
04:00
in your mind before your life was tipped
04:02
upside down? Yeah. Before everything
04:04
changed cuz it was so sudden. I mean it
04:06
was over the course of what 10 weeks and
04:08
all of a sudden that's it. You're not
04:09
you're not going home again.
04:10
Yeah. I mean probably like a birthday
04:11
meal I had with some f I used to live
04:15
next to Chinese restaurant. Um and it
04:17
was like my favorite restaurant.
04:22
So I used to come home from school every
04:25
day. I'd get up to my bedroom, like open
04:26
the window and stick my head out.
04:28
Smell it.
04:30
Woo! You know, and uh that was like
04:31
where I went for my birthday meals. But
04:35
I'd say I'd say probably the the biggest
04:38
stuff would probably be there was a
04:41
river. house called the River Dane where
04:43
you know everyone would go down in the
04:45
summer and you'd buy like those little
04:47
disposable barbecues. You used to take
04:49
and someone would be in charge of like
04:51
buying sausages and someone would have
04:53
to buy the drinks
04:55
floor barbecues to put on.
04:56
Yeah. And you like put them on the floor
04:57
and then you try and squeeze like
04:58
somehow 12 sausages onto this like tiny
05:01
thing.
05:04
Um Okay. What's the one prevailing
05:05
memory you have today of that? Was it
05:08
four years?
05:13
Five.
05:14
Five years.
05:14
Yeah.
05:15
What's the one What's one that really
05:15
jumps out?
05:17
One of my favorite memories.
05:18
I'll give you two. The first one was
05:21
when we'd just been formed as a band.
05:25
There was like a picture of us that had
05:27
been taken from when we were at the
05:30
show. Like someone's mom had taken it.
05:32
And it was like the first picture of us
05:34
is the five of us. and we were staying
05:36
at my stepdad's house. We were like
05:40
living in this little bungalow, all of
05:43
us together to like practice and we were
05:45
just like singing songs and basically
05:47
just had a sleepover for like 4 days and
05:49
everyone drove down and there's a tiny
05:52
little uh like news agents down the
05:55
street and we'd heard this picture was
05:57
being put in the paper. So we were like,
05:59
"Oh, we're going to be in the paper."
06:03
Like that's crazy. So, the five of us
06:05
like w like left this little bungalow
06:09
and walked down to the news agents and
06:11
got the paper and then came back and had
06:13
breakfast and we're all just like
06:16
sitting staring at the paper and like
06:17
passing around the paper and we're like,
06:19
"Let me see it again. Let me see it
06:21
again."
06:22
And uh I don't know. I guess just cuz we
06:23
had we just didn't know what was going
06:26
to happen.
06:28
It's a timeless image. That's a timeless
06:28
image.
06:30
We were so happy about it. that first
06:31
real piece of like recognition when you
06:34
when you realize that it's not it's not
06:36
a controlled environment anymore. Like
06:38
people that you don't know down the
06:40
street can actually take a look at you
06:41
or hear you is
06:43
that's still without a doubt a
06:44
life-changing moment for every artist I
06:47
respect.
06:49
Yeah, cuz it only happens one time, too.
06:49
Oh, after that everything kind of
06:52
changes.
06:53
Yeah, cuz we were we were watching X
06:54
Factor at my family. We were at my
06:58
cousin's house the day that my audition
07:00
went on air
07:04
and you know we watched it and we're
07:05
like, "Oh my god, that's crazy." And
07:08
then we're driving home and we go to a
07:10
petrol station to stop off and fill up
07:12
and I'm in the petrol station and this
07:15
guy goes, "Were you just on X Factor?"
07:18
And I was like,
07:21
"Yes, I was."
07:24
Um, but yeah, I'd say that. And then the
07:27
other one, I guess once the band had
07:30
really started was we were in Sweden
07:32
recording What Makes You Beautiful in
07:35
the studio,
07:38
someone came up into the room and was
07:39
like, "There's two girls outside."
07:41
And we were like, "Why?"
07:45
And they're like, "They're they're like
07:48
looking for you." And we were all just
07:50
like, "But we're in Sweden."
07:53
You know, so that was like another
07:56
same. Yeah.
08:00
Yeah. I mean,
08:00
that was kind of thing like, "Oh my god,
08:01
that's so crazy." Like, "We're in
08:03
Sweden. How how you know, fast forward
08:04
to the end of it and you are out here a
08:08
few months afterwards and like that
08:10
decompression leading into the writing
08:12
of the first album, right? getting into
08:14
your self-titled album. That idea of um
08:15
having some independence for the first
08:18
time really to kind of do whatever you
08:20
want. How'd that feel?
08:21
Uh
08:23
pretty amazing actually. I didn't really
08:24
have a plan for like when I wanted to
08:27
make a record. I knew I wanted to start
08:29
writing some point. Um and that's kind
08:32
of why I came out here and I started
08:36
with Kid Oone.
08:37
So Sweet Creature was the first song we
08:40
did. That was like in my first writing
08:42
sessions when I kind of started like
08:45
because up up until that point I'd done
08:48
a lot of sessions with different people
08:50
and
08:52
I tried to write with as many different
08:53
people as possible just to feel like
08:55
just to like learn. I just wanted to
08:58
learn. And it was like the best way I've
09:00
ever heard songwriting described is like
09:03
it's kind of like surfing in that you
09:06
can practice getting up on the board as
09:10
much as you want and sometimes the wave
09:12
just doesn't come or the wave comes but
09:14
you haven't practiced getting up on the
09:17
board enough. Every now and again you've
09:19
practiced enough and the wave comes and
09:22
that's when
09:24
you write that song.
09:25
That's when that's when it comes
09:26
through. That's when the music
09:27
everything's in the right place. So, I
09:28
kind of always wanted to be prepared to
09:30
stand up on the board whenever the wave
09:32
came. Do you surf?
09:34
Not enough. I wish I surfed more. I
09:36
actually The waves out here are really
09:38
in really intense. And I think the last
09:40
time I surfed was here and I got
09:43
absolutely beaten up. I kept like
09:45
flipping. It
09:47
was terrible.
09:48
Yeah. I mean, it's it's a good look
09:49
until you get in the water and you
09:50
realize that you're a little out of your
09:51
depth, literally. Um, how important was
09:52
friendship to you when you started out
09:54
as well? because you were trying out
09:56
with, like you say, you were trying lots
09:57
of different songwriters, but I felt
09:59
like when the album finally came out,
10:00
you'd found a tight group of friends who
10:02
were more than just collaborators. I'd
10:04
say to finish the the thought when I'd
10:06
been writing in the band, it was kind of
10:09
like if I'd ever written stuff that that
10:12
was just with a friend or something, it
10:15
was kind of like, well, I'm not going to
10:19
release any music, but what would it
10:20
sound like if I was to write a song that
10:23
was for me?
10:26
Was that a contractual thing or was it
10:26
just a loyalty to the band thing?
10:28
Just didn't really want to.
10:30
Yeah. and um
10:32
definitely didn't have time to.
10:35
Yeah. Right.
10:36
But I knew that like maybe one day I'd
10:37
want to do it, but I wasn't like I can't
10:40
wait to get out of this thing so I can
10:43
go make my own record.
10:44
Yeah.
10:46
You know.
10:46
So, did the end of it creep up on you?
10:46
A little bit. Well, I wouldn't say crept
10:49
up. I guess the last year of it, we all
10:52
kind of knew we were going to stop at
10:56
the end of that year.
10:58
So, how do you know? I mean, you know,
10:59
it's it's this juggernaut. It's just
11:01
non-stop.
11:02
Well, we would have like we'd sit down
11:02
and have conversations about like
11:04
everyone good, everyone wants to keep
11:06
going and that kind of thing. And
11:07
there was a part of me where
11:09
I felt like all of the decisions I'd
11:13
made as an adult that affected
11:16
my life and what I had to what I was
11:20
doing with my life had been made as a
11:23
group. And I think there was a part of
11:25
me that felt like I wanted to make some
11:29
decisions for myself where it was like
11:31
you never really had to make the
11:35
decision because I could I could put my
11:37
hat in the ring but still be like oh
11:39
well majority rules and I got outvoted.
11:41
I felt like I need to make some
11:44
decisions that
11:46
just affect me. you know, Zayn already
11:48
did that and he bounced out mid tour and
11:51
I I think it was pretty amazing you guys
11:53
saw that tour through for fans. I think
11:55
it was probably a wobbly 24 hours for
11:57
people where they thought, well, that's
11:58
going to start something.
12:00
But looking back on it now, like how
12:01
challenging was that to complete that
12:03
tour and to see that through and and
12:05
how, you know, how impactful was that
12:07
decision for him to to not see see it
12:09
through to the end? Yeah, I mean it was
12:12
uh I mean it was it was hard, you know.
12:15
Part of it was it was kind of like we
12:19
were sad obviously that someone had
12:22
left, but also sad that he was so he was
12:26
not enjoying it so much that he had to
12:31
leave because I think at the time too
12:33
the tour and everything was going so
12:36
well and we were everyone had kind of
12:37
got to this place where everyone was
12:39
kind of living in a way where
12:42
they I think felt pretty good while
12:45
like enjoy Yeah, it felt like everyone
12:48
was kind of enjoying it and um yeah, I'd
12:51
say a big part of it was was us kind of
12:55
being like, "Wow, we didn't realize he
12:58
wasn't enjoying it that much." You know,
13:01
you know, obviously there was a big
13:04
there was big moments for us where we
13:06
were like, "What are we doing?" You
13:08
know, cuz we were about to start
13:10
recording a new album and stuff and it
13:11
was like,
13:13
"Are we just are we recording this
13:14
without him?" But I'd say in the moment,
13:16
I guess the the four of us became
13:19
closer.
13:22
Um cuz we were like, "Okay, this is a
13:24
hurdle that we weren't expecting." And I
13:27
think you deal with this in many
13:29
different places when when you're work
13:31
with like traveling and touring and it's
13:33
a demanding thing and not everyone likes
13:36
doing it, but it's kind of like if
13:38
someone's not enjoying it, you'd rather
13:41
they
13:43
don't do it. That's why contracts are
13:45
strange to me. Like I understand there's
13:47
a desire to do them when there's a lot
13:48
of money involved and in particular when
13:50
there's there are certain businesses
13:51
that that really work, but in the arts
13:53
and things that are creative, like I
13:55
never understand keeping people against
13:56
their will. Like you're not going to get
13:57
good work.
13:58
I never get that with like the record
13:59
deal stuff where it's like
14:01
why would you you know like when people
14:03
like won't release people from contracts
14:05
and stuff. It's like why would you want
14:07
why would you want a begrudged employer
14:09
like an artist to make stuff for you
14:12
when they don't want to make stuff? It
14:14
seems like completely counter productive
14:16
to me, but I mean,
14:18
you know,
14:20
I'm also not a businessman. So,
14:20
you're doing all right in that
14:22
department there. So, you've got some
14:23
good instincts. You know, you hire Well,
14:24
I don't know if maybe
14:27
I'd say my gut is the only thing that I
14:29
do trust
14:31
in terms of people.
14:33
That's really important, right? I mean,
14:34
there's only two rules you should really
14:35
live by. Instinct and diligence, right?
14:36
One gets you into the room. The second
14:38
one makes you double check and make sure
14:40
you should stay there. I can also tell
14:41
because the times where I've ever been
14:43
like really really upset by people
14:45
Yeah.
14:48
is when I'm more upset with myself when
14:48
I've got it wrong
14:52
cuz I feel like I have a really I'm like
14:53
I feel like I'm a pretty good judge of
14:55
character
14:57
and that's the only time I feel myself
14:58
get really upset with stuff like that is
15:01
where you're like, "Oh, I trust this
15:03
person or you know I feel like
15:05
they're a good thing." and then it goes
15:08
the other way and you're kind of like I
15:10
got that wrong and then I end up like
15:12
really bummed out about it for a while.
15:14
Yeah. Yeah. That's it's classic hard on
15:17
yourself syndrome to be honest with you.
15:19
You know, taking other people's [ __ ]
15:20
and blaming yourself for it. It's that
15:22
it's therapy 101. Therapy 101. Have you
15:24
tried that therapy?
15:27
I love it.
15:28
Uh yeah, I have actually. Yeah,
15:28
I love it. Yeah. I think for a really
15:30
long time, especially when I started
15:32
coming to California,
15:34
there was a big thing for me where I
15:37
felt like everyone went to therapy.
15:39
They do,
15:41
right? And I I think for a long time I
15:42
was like, I don't need that. You know,
15:45
it's very like British way of looking at
15:48
it, I think. And then I think there was
15:50
a point where I kind of was trying to
15:52
work out a lot more stuff about myself
15:56
because obviously then I was then it was
15:59
just me working on
16:02
your own. Yeah.
16:02
Um
16:04
and I think it kind of comes with when
16:05
you're trying to make music you're it's
16:08
so naval gazing. You're just like like
16:09
the making an album I feel like is the
16:12
most selfindulgent
16:15
time you you can think of really cuz
16:17
you're just like
16:21
oh if you didn't have the opportunity to
16:22
share it if you didn't actually finish
16:23
and share it with us
16:25
it would be narcissism of the most epic
16:27
order.
16:29
Can you imagine you just make like an
16:29
album and then you don't release it.
16:31
It's therapy I suppose in a weird way
16:34
but then we get we get the trade. That's
16:35
what we get is we get the trade on it.
16:37
We get all that kind of naval gazing as
16:39
you put it in and that self-reflection
16:41
somehow for forms this magic shape that
16:43
we get to apply to our own lives and
16:46
then we become narcissistic because we
16:47
say well Harry's speaking to me right
16:49
so I get to apply to her right but yeah
16:51
I think I think with the therapy thing I
16:55
just realized I was just getting in my
16:56
own way you know it's been a thing where
16:58
I've definitely felt it have an impact
17:02
on my life and something that I've kind
17:05
of introduced some friends to who were
17:09
going through stuff and they were very
17:11
skeptical about it.
17:13
I would assume you're a good friend.
17:15
You're a loyal person.
17:16
Try to be.
17:18
Yeah. So, who who are some of your best
17:19
friends? Who are the people that help
17:21
you through these times? That are some
17:23
of the people that you know really that
17:24
you're close to. I'm pretty lucky
17:26
actually with with that stuff because
17:29
and it's probably why I didn't go to
17:32
therapy earlier is because
17:34
I have those friends where I'll have the
17:37
same conversation that I would have with
17:39
a therapist. I was at this talk thing
17:42
where Alan Debotton was talking and he
17:45
was talking about how like real
17:49
friendship is just built on
17:52
vulnerability. The second you open up to
17:53
someone with like a real thing is when
17:56
you actually get to know someone. So I
18:00
definitely got if there was someone that
18:03
I was friends with and I felt like oh I
18:05
want to be like close to them just open
18:08
up really kind of straight away. And
18:10
doing that has definitely caused me to
18:15
become much closer with like
18:18
just people just my all of my friends in
18:22
general I'd say.
18:24
How did you feel about um when you
18:26
started started on this on this new
18:27
album right on Fine Line? Had your
18:29
opinion changed about your self-titled
18:31
debut? Were there things that you felt
18:32
in the heat of the moment in the process
18:35
of of coming out of One Direction and
18:36
making a solo record that you would do
18:38
differently or that you felt that album
18:41
didn't quite achieve?
18:42
Um, when I like listen to the first
18:43
album now, I can hear all of the places
18:46
where I feel like I was playing it safe
18:49
cuz I just didn't want to get it wrong.
18:51
I just didn't want to get it wrong. So,
18:53
you started with a mid-tempo 7 minute
18:55
single, bro. I mean, it wasn't that safe
18:57
to be fair.
18:59
Yeah. Uh, apart from that,
19:00
carry on.
19:02
But, um, I guess a big part of going
19:03
into this album was I spent a lot of
19:06
time kind of thinking about the whole
19:09
process of you make an album, then you
19:12
put it out and you, you know, kind of
19:15
release it and then you tour it. and all
19:18
of the bits that I didn't enjoy as much,
19:20
I kind of went into the second one
19:24
feeling like I want to work out how to
19:27
make all of this feel really fun.
19:30
So that's why you drink margaritas
19:33
and do mushrooms.
19:35
Yeah. Yeah. I guess I I think it was
19:36
kind of moo.
19:39
I guess I had this moment where I was
19:40
like I would rather not do it than do it
19:42
and it not be fun. Making this album was
19:44
all about freedom. Yeah, of course.
19:47
Sounds it.
19:49
I had a big moment of I guess through
19:49
the whole making of this record. I was
19:52
kind of trying to redefine what success
19:55
meant to me for so long, especially in
19:58
the band. It was like every album got
20:01
bigger and every tour got bigger and it
20:02
was like always growing. And I think
20:04
when I went to make the first record, it
20:07
was kind of freeing cuz I felt like,
20:09
well, I don't have to do this anymore.
20:11
You're still like, "Well, if the last
20:14
band thing was this and then your first
20:16
thing,
20:18
oh, everyone's lined up to judge.
20:19
Everyone is lined up to judge." Like,
20:21
you come out with that first album and
20:23
it doesn't smash it.
20:24
It's like, "Oh, well, I guess out of the
20:26
band, it's a nogo." Right.
20:28
Right.
20:30
And so for me, when that album came out,
20:31
I felt you already were kind of
20:33
redefining success in your own terms
20:35
because you went and connected with your
20:36
audience. a thought to me at least like
20:38
in a very real way like he went back to
20:39
to to trying to really connect with
20:41
people. You can't connect in a baseball
20:43
stadium,
20:45
right?
20:46
That was a thing that I'd always said I
20:47
wanted to do when we kind of
20:49
started and when we started doing the
20:51
music it was like
20:53
kind of said to my manager like the
20:55
first tour that I do I want it to be
20:57
really small and then I guess with with
21:00
this one it was like I just wanted to
21:02
have fun. I just wanted to have so much
21:04
fun.
21:05
That's what success is. That's where you
21:06
landed on the redefinition of success.
21:07
Yeah. And one of my friends kind of
21:09
said, "If you're happy doing what you're
21:11
doing, then nobody can tell you you're
21:14
not successful."
21:17
I mean, it's so obvious, but it's also
21:18
the kind of thing where probably four
21:21
years ago, if someone had said that to
21:23
me, I'd be like, "Okay,
21:25
cuz you were too busy making everybody
21:26
else happy." And also, I guess when I
21:28
was in the band, there was a big thing
21:30
of cuz we would make the last three
21:31
records we made on the road and
21:33
I had friends who are musicians who I
21:36
knew would like they would tour and then
21:38
they would take 6 months off to go make
21:40
a Yeah. into a process.
21:44
And I used to be like, "Oh my god,
21:45
you can do that."
21:46
Well, so you're just like you're just
21:48
making that's it.
21:50
You that's all you're doing.
21:51
You're in room6067. You're just making
21:52
at the Marriott in Hong Kong surrounded
21:55
by
21:57
four mattresses and one over the top.
21:58
Yeah, exactly.
22:00
Um on the last two tours as well, we
22:02
bought this like old surveillance van
22:05
and converted it into a studio so it
22:08
would follow the tour around. So like at
22:10
the venue, you'd go into this tiny
22:12
little surveillance van that had no air
22:14
conditioning.
22:16
What you in One Direction would go in
22:17
the back, we'd recorded songs in the
22:18
back of a van on the road.
22:19
So we had
22:20
That's the bossiest [ __ ] Yeah. See,
22:21
people are walking past the van have got
22:23
no idea.
22:25
Well, it'd be like in the venue.
22:25
In the venue, right? Okay.
22:27
Um, it's crazy.
22:28
It's fun to record it like that. It's
22:29
just a totally different process.
22:32
The album starts with golden, which is
22:34
like you said before that vulnerability
22:35
is the way to great friendship, and I
22:37
feel like that song establishes that. I
22:38
mean, there's a lot of like, I know
22:39
you're scared, but man, I'm just going
22:40
to tell you the truth.
22:42
I feel like that's what that song is
22:43
about. It's kind of it sets the stall
22:44
out for the album, too. It's a very
22:46
personal album. Golden we wrote on day
22:47
two of being in Shangrila. That was kind
22:51
of like an immediately as soon as we'd
22:55
done it, it was like, "Oh, this is this
22:57
is track one."
22:59
You knew it. I love that feeling. It's
22:59
one of the best parts of making a record
23:01
is making a track list as you go.
23:02
Cuz I always end up with track one and
23:04
the last track and then you're like,
23:05
"Okay, let's see what
23:07
So you knew Fine Line would be the last
23:08
track."
23:09
Yeah. As soon as we do,
23:10
you know, it was the album title as
23:10
well.
23:11
No.
23:12
It's such a powerful piece of music. We
23:13
can skip to the end if you want. That's
23:15
like that is one of my favorite songs of
23:17
the year. I mean that's just that's a
23:19
stunner, man. Um Golden came really
23:21
early and then I used to drive from here
23:23
to the studio and listen to it and it's
23:26
kind of like as soon as we had it,
23:30
Golden was like the perfect BCH song.
23:32
Magic,
23:35
you know? It's like driving down the
23:36
coast. It was just that is what the song
23:37
is for. Like it feels so Malibu to me
23:40
that song. I heard that the first person
23:43
you played the full album to was Liam
23:45
Gallagher. Is that true? One of the
23:47
first people.
23:49
Uh yeah, I guess by accident, I guess.
23:49
So, what happened?
23:52
Well, he was in uh we were working in a
23:53
studio in London and he was in
23:55
we were kind of trying to finish up
23:57
and he was in the studio next door. He
24:01
came in at I can't remember how it
24:04
happened, but he kind of just ended up
24:06
Yeah, it was the first time he kind of
24:09
just ended up in there listening,
24:11
which was crazy. You know, I was a
24:14
massive Oasis fan growing up. And then
24:15
he invited us all over to go listen to
24:18
his record and we listened and we all
24:20
like had fish and chips and talked and
24:23
stuff and he's really he's cool.
24:25
I'd imagine Watermelon Sugar would have
24:28
been a standout for him. I don't know
24:29
why. Just kind of feels like that's his
24:31
vibe. That was I don't even know if we
24:32
Oh, yeah. Maybe we played in that. But
24:35
none of the none of that stuff was
24:36
finished. I don't think that had horns
24:39
on it yet.
24:40
Right.
24:41
Lights up I don't think was written.
24:42
Lights up, Adore You, Treat People, and
24:46
uh yeah, those three I think were all
24:51
hadn't been done yet. They were all like
24:54
the last week basically. Watermelon
24:56
Sugar, which um at this point is out and
24:59
you performed on SNL. Um and everyone's
25:01
kind of figured out what it's about. Uh
25:04
the joys of, you know, mutually
25:06
appreciated oral pleasure.
25:09
Um
25:12
is that what it's about?
25:12
Is it?
25:14
I don't know.
25:14
That's what everyone's saying.
25:15
Oh,
25:16
always good to leave it open to
25:17
interpretation.
25:18
Yeah, of course. Yeah.
25:19
Um but it's something that just seems to
25:20
kind of followed you around. on that
25:22
idea of you not just being a sex symbol,
25:23
but that a lot of your music is inspired
25:25
by this.
25:27
It's uncomfortable.
25:28
Yeah, I reckon. But I actually wanted to
25:29
ask you a genuinely serious question
25:31
about that because people throw it
25:32
around like it's fod, but it is actually
25:34
awkward, right? Like how do you feel
25:37
sometimes when people seem very focused
25:39
on you in that light?
25:42
In all honesty, I'd say I try and think
25:45
about it as little as possible because
25:47
it's a very strange dynamic thing.
25:49
Um, it's also like a weird thing to
25:53
think of about yourself. Totally. Like,
25:55
um,
25:58
I guess the thing with like sex in
25:59
general is like it used to feel so much
26:02
more taboo for me to even like even like
26:05
when we're in the band like the thought
26:09
of people thinking that I had sex was
26:10
like, "Oh no, that's crazy." Like, "What
26:13
if they know?" But it's like,
26:15
you know?
26:18
Yeah. So come even just like coming into
26:18
this record, I I wanted to feel a little
26:21
less like guarded with stuff. I wanted
26:24
to feel a lot freer and just more joyful
26:26
and like honest. And
26:29
I think a lot of the time with like when
26:31
there's like tabloid stuff for example
26:34
of like people breaking up and you know
26:36
it's like I think people forget that
26:39
there's like a person who's also broken
26:41
up with someone
26:43
which is sad. like
26:45
you get sad when you break up with
26:47
someone.
26:48
Yeah, it feels to me this album in part
26:49
and excuse me if I'm being too personal,
26:51
but based on the music, it feels like a
26:53
breakup record in in in some respects.
26:55
This one particular song like a song
26:57
called Cherry, which is
26:59
crazy. I mean, cutting right to it, you
27:01
know, with some real imagery of um
27:04
losing someone to someone else and there
27:07
still being that remnant
27:09
of uh your relationship moving into a
27:11
new space, which is right at the core of
27:14
heartbreak. I mean,
27:16
that's like one of the most devastating
27:17
images if you're lucky enough to get
27:19
your heart broken. That's one of the
27:20
most devastating images you can go
27:21
through. And you're also quite specific,
27:22
you know, in terms of it feels to me
27:24
like it's quite specific in referencing
27:25
your the relationship you've been in.
27:28
Yeah. Yeah. And it's kind of like it's a
27:30
weird one for me cuz I'm always like,
27:32
you know, I don't
27:35
like to kind of explain songs or like
27:37
kind of explain the meaning behind them
27:41
and stuff like that. But I think with
27:43
this record, it's so much more open.
27:45
Yeah.
27:47
That it's like,
27:48
but you've told us in the
27:50
Yeah.
27:52
Like it tells you what it is, you know?
27:52
I think a thing that I like about kind
27:55
of definitely where this record went,
27:58
especially compared to the last one, is
28:00
like when I start making an album, I
28:03
don't feel like, oh, I'm making an album
28:08
that I'm going to put out in December of
28:10
next year or it feels like I just start
28:12
writing some songs and then so then I
28:15
can be as honest as possible. And then
28:18
the time when you get to decide if you
28:21
think it's too honest is when you're
28:23
putting it out. And I never want to like
28:25
trim that stuff down. So you never
28:28
thought for one second when you listen
28:30
back to Cherry later on that we'd be
28:32
having a conversation or or other people
28:35
would be listening to it trying to
28:37
decipher it and how that would make you
28:38
feel. You felt you wanted to be true to
28:39
it.
28:41
I think I wanted to be true to it. I
28:42
think the moment that I wrote it, I
28:44
wanted to be true to the moment that I
28:46
wrote it and how I was feeling then. And
28:48
the thing with the
28:52
How are you feeling then?
28:53
Not great.
28:55
the but I think also in the moment I
28:57
felt I felt like I was realizing
29:00
some stuff about it was all part of like
29:04
being more open and
29:07
you know not being like I don't care.
29:10
It's like no like you get petty when you
29:14
know when it's when something's not
29:17
going the way that you want. Like you
29:19
get petty with that stuff. And I think
29:21
there's something with Cherry where it's
29:24
like it's so pathetic kind of in a way.
29:26
The night that
29:30
I wrote it, we'd been writing for a few
29:32
weeks and
29:36
everyone had uh left the studio. It was
29:39
me, uh Tyler, and Sammy, who's our
29:41
engineer. And we were kind of sitting
29:44
around talking at like
29:47
2:00 a.m. maybe. And I was saying that I
29:50
was feeling a lot of pressure because
29:54
the last record wasn't like a radio
29:56
record.
29:59
I felt like a lot of pressure to be
30:01
making these like big songs.
30:03
And I was like, I feel like it this
30:06
record has to be really big. So I feel
30:08
like I need to make certain songs.
30:11
You know, I have all these ideas about
30:14
records that I want to make. And I want
30:16
to make this record in 5 years. I want
30:18
to make this record in 10 years and I
30:20
want to make like just these ideas for
30:22
records that I want to make. And we had
30:25
this conversation and Tyler just said to
30:28
me,
30:30
"You just have to make the record that
30:32
you want to make right now. That's it.
30:34
There's no like, let me make sure this
30:38
one's a commercial success so that I can
30:40
make what I want later down the road."
30:43
Um, you just have to make the record
30:45
that you want to make right now.
30:48
He's right.
30:50
So then we stayed up and wrote Cherry
30:50
that night.
30:53
So
30:54
how' you So you felt bad when you wrote
30:54
it. How did you feel when you finished
30:56
it?
30:57
So good. Like I loved it so much. It
30:57
Who's this? Who's speaking at the end?
31:01
What's the vocal at the end that cuts?
31:03
That was my ex-girlfriend.
31:04
Yeah. So that's interesting. And I think
31:05
it's super cool that you left that in
31:07
obviously from a sort of imagery point
31:08
of view cuz I love all that stuff. I
31:10
love hearing things that revolve around
31:11
music and aren't necessarily just tied
31:13
to a structure.
31:14
But the decision to keep, you know, your
31:15
ex-girlfriend speaking at the end of the
31:16
song is like so blunt and so straight up
31:18
like what the was going through your
31:20
mind. Like anyone else who's just broken
31:22
up with someone right now is like not on
31:24
a your wildest day would I do that?
31:25
Yeah, I know. Uh I don't know. I think
31:27
it was like cuz it got added in later on
31:30
and it felt so part of the song. It just
31:34
felt like it needed it. We're friends
31:37
and stuff, so I asked her if it was okay
31:40
and she was okay with it.
31:42
What did she think of the song?
31:44
Um, I think she liked it. Come on, man.
31:45
It's written about it, right? You got to
31:48
go, you got to love that at the end of
31:50
the day, man. I mean, um, there's a song
31:51
called Falling on the Record, which the
31:54
first time I heard it was like everyone
31:55
was just flawed and it's a real
31:56
standout. It's going to become something
31:58
I think that people will carry with them
32:00
irrespective of the context of the
32:01
album. They'll zero in on that song as
32:03
well in its own way. And um Tom was
32:05
telling me that that that was that came
32:07
super fast.
32:09
Mhm.
32:10
I was going out for dinner, I think, and
32:10
I was getting picked up from Tom's
32:14
house. So, he came to pick me up and I
32:16
was showering and he was like playing on
32:19
the piano and as I came out of the
32:22
shower, he was playing like the d.
32:23
I went and stood next to him at the
32:27
piano just in a towel and we just kind
32:29
of wrote the whole thing. So it was
32:32
really
32:35
How long? How long did it take?
32:35
I'd say falling maybe took like
32:37
probably 20 minutes.
32:40
I mean that's 20 minutes in a towel.
32:41
That's real friendship.
32:44
Yeah, that's
32:45
Yeah, right.
32:46
3 days.
32:46
Okay, we finished it. Please go put
32:47
some put some pants on us.
32:49
That's one of those moments, right,
32:52
where the surfing the surfing analogy
32:53
where
32:54
the wave and the practice
32:55
all comes together.
32:57
Where do you think they came from? The
32:58
subject matter if it came so quick.
33:00
Um
33:02
what do you think you were saying in
33:02
that song? I'm listening back to it now.
33:03
I think it was like for me what I hadn't
33:04
really experienced before was during the
33:07
making of this record, the times when I
33:10
felt good and I felt happy were like the
33:12
happiest I've ever felt in my life. And
33:15
the times when I felt sad was like the
33:17
lowest I ever felt in my life. And I
33:19
think it was kind of
33:22
that feeling of when you can feel
33:24
yourself kind of falling back into one
33:26
of those moments where where you're
33:28
there and the chorus says like what am I
33:30
now? Am I someone I don't want around?
33:33
It was kind of like
33:35
Yeah, it's powerful. was super
33:36
self-absorbed and self-indulgent in a in
33:37
a sort of like self way
33:39
kind of I guess it was a big moment
33:42
where I was kind of asking myself like
33:44
who am I like what am I doing kind of
33:45
and there's imagery in there of being
33:49
too drunk and wandering hands and all
33:50
that stuff that all the all the guilt
33:52
points
33:54
yeah it's like
33:55
I kind of started to feel like threads
33:57
of you know where I could see myself
34:00
becoming someone that I didn't want to
34:03
be
34:04
and uh and that is really hard. But I
34:05
think that the thing that's nice with
34:09
that is you get to write a song about it
34:10
and be like, "Okay, next."
34:12
You know,
34:14
and who helps you at those moments? Does
34:15
your mom still play a really important
34:17
role, your family? And by the way, you
34:19
don't have to be you.
34:21
There are people doing all kinds of
34:22
things in all walks of life who are
34:23
losing their way and need people to
34:25
bring them back into line. So,
34:26
let's just talk about that relationship
34:28
for a second because I know family is a
34:29
big thing for you.
34:31
My like I'm so lucky with my family.
34:32
They've always just been really
34:34
supportive and that's kind of it's kind
34:37
of all you
34:41
can ask for with with like doing this is
34:43
obviously
34:47
you know sometimes you don't want to go
34:48
home and be like I'm miserable right now
34:51
cuz you want to be like no I'm fine
34:53
don't worry about me
34:56
and that happens too but also
34:57
have the relationship with my family
34:59
where if I need to have that
35:02
conversation I Can
35:03
What's the best bit of advice your mom's
35:04
given you?
35:06
The thing with my mom is she's less of
35:07
like a she's less of like a sound bite
35:09
of advice. She's more she's like the
35:12
kindest woman I know, you know? So for
35:16
me it's always been like just watching
35:19
her how she is with people and and stuff
35:21
is like she just I just don't think she
35:25
has like a bad bone which is an
35:27
incredible thing to grow up around to
35:30
have that person like supporting you is
35:32
um it's amazing. She's the best. She's
35:36
like actually the best. So who do you
35:39
miss the most? Who do you wish was still
35:43
around?
35:45
probably my stepdad.
35:47
Stepdad passed away a couple years ago.
35:50
Um,
35:52
that's tough.
35:54
He was pretty great. He was like a
35:54
pretty great guy.
35:56
Yeah. And what have you learned sort of
35:57
going through life now as you're kind of
35:59
experiencing loss? Because we all have
36:00
to cross that bridge and
36:02
yeah,
36:03
that's kind of sobering and then that's
36:03
when adulthood's really knocking on your
36:04
door and you start to really take
36:06
advantage of and and rep prioritize
36:07
things. and you know coming out the
36:09
other end of that really really high
36:10
octane visceral childhood that you had
36:12
into your 20s
36:14
and getting into your second album and
36:15
being an independent human being who's
36:17
got a strong relationship with your
36:18
family like
36:20
how have your priorities shifted and
36:21
what are the things that that really
36:22
come into focus for you now
36:24
friendships are probably just the most
36:26
important thing to me like the people
36:29
I'm really close with are just I'd say
36:31
way more important to me than anything
36:35
else
36:36
I've definitely felt a different in the
36:38
conversations that I have with friends.
36:41
I guess since you like experience death
36:44
more when you're a kid and you lose a
36:46
grandparent or something.
36:49
Yeah.
36:51
And it's really sad but also it's like
36:51
oh grandparents are the people who die
36:54
first.
36:56
That's there's some natural order to
36:56
that.
36:58
Yeah. And um
36:58
I think like the first time you lose
37:01
like a friend
37:04
is when you really feel like an adult.
37:06
You're kind of like, "Wow."
37:08
It's because it's one of the first
37:10
experiences you have, I think, where you
37:11
lose control. Completely lose control.
37:12
You know, I think you have those those
37:15
moments where, and every single person
37:17
does it, who's ever lost a friend,
37:19
where,
37:22
you know, whether you're close to them
37:24
or not, I think everyone has that thing
37:25
of like,
37:29
I wish I'd just asked one more time if
37:31
they were okay, you know? And if there's
37:34
any positive thing that could possibly
37:38
come out of that, it's that
37:41
now the conversations that I have with
37:44
friends about that stuff is is way
37:46
different in terms of like,
37:48
you know, you ask a friend if they're
37:52
okay. And it's like, yeah, yeah, I'm
37:53
good. And you're like, I'm like more
37:55
prepared to have that like, no, but you
37:58
know,
38:00
give me the roster.
38:01
You're actually okay.
38:01
Give me the roster. you know, and that's
38:02
like their conversations that I have
38:04
with my friends now.
38:07
And you're equally vulnerable in your
38:08
own way. And you're able to go back.
38:10
Absolutely.
38:11
And I think that's like a really
38:12
important thing. And that obviously,
38:14
like I said earlier, is where like real
38:16
friendship comes from
38:19
and I don't think everyone's lucky
38:20
enough to have it. And I don't think it
38:23
happens all the time. So so interesting
38:25
that you know you came out of this
38:27
experience which has left so many people
38:28
isolated and fearful and paranoid and
38:30
not wanting to connect with human spirit
38:33
because they've had non-stop human
38:36
spirit surrounding them for years,
38:38
right? And you're like so different.
38:40
It's like you just kind of called time
38:42
on it and then just went searching for
38:43
real human experience almost
38:45
immediately. You know, you came to
38:47
California in the search for people and
38:49
for experience and for
38:50
Yeah.
38:52
and for relationships. I mean the thing
38:52
with my relationship with California is
38:54
like it's also definitely changed over
38:56
the last few years but when I first came
38:58
here it was like oh if you get to move
39:00
here it means you've made it like you
39:02
did good. I mean to be fair.
39:07
Yeah but this is my house.
39:10
But but uh you know you get this like
39:12
it's everywhere you've seen in movies
39:16
and you're kind of like oh it's amazing
39:18
like you're in the mix and
39:20
you get to be here
39:22
and I think the more time I spent here I
39:24
was like oh no actually if you can come
39:28
here and then leave is when you feel
39:31
really great. If you're like oh yeah
39:34
that's amazing.
39:36
See you in two months.
39:37
See you in a bit. Yeah. But that just
39:38
goes back to what you were saying about
39:40
you strike me as being someone who's
39:42
just restless.
39:43
Yeah. I mean the thing with here is like
39:44
I've never felt at home here in LA which
39:47
is you know in one sense not great but
39:51
at the same time I always feel like I'm
39:54
on holiday when I'm here.
39:56
Yeah it's fair.
39:58
So I really enjoy being here. A lot of
39:58
my closest friends are here which is
40:01
where I usually feel the best is when I
40:04
can see those people. So, as this kind
40:06
of as this conversation comes to a
40:08
natural end, as the sun goes down on on
40:10
our on our time on our time together, um
40:12
what is London to you then if if that's
40:15
the closest thing to home?
40:18
Um
40:19
London's like just where I'll want to be
40:22
at some point. And it's a weird one
40:26
because after traveling so much, I don't
40:29
think I don't look at the future as like
40:32
I'm going to live in this one place and
40:35
then I'll never move anywhere. I think
40:36
it's just about like being happy. I just
40:39
want to be happy. And if
40:41
And are you?
40:43
If I feel pretty good right now. Yeah.
40:43
You had fun making this album?
40:47
Uh yeah, so much fun.
40:48
What's the most fun memory of making
40:50
this album? I'd say I'd say probably my
40:52
favorite memory from from making this
40:54
one of at least was the day we wrote
40:57
Golden.
41:00
We stopped and went to have dinner and
41:02
we're all sat in the kitchen at
41:04
Shangrila
41:05
and we kind of just played it like on
41:07
one guitar and everyone kind of singing
41:10
it around the the table like and
41:14
it just felt really good. like it felt
41:19
so much more joyous than last time. And
41:21
I I think that makes sense because like
41:25
you said, the first single was a seven
41:27
minute piano ballad. So like it would
41:29
have been weird to come out being really
41:31
joyous.
41:33
But
41:34
you keep going.
41:41
Oh yeah,
41:42
still speeding.
41:43
Yeah, keep going.
41:43
Okay, great. Um, and and I think part of
41:44
the thing with like the mushrooms thing
41:47
for me is that I never do anything when
41:50
I'm working.
41:53
Mhm.
41:54
And
41:54
I don't even drink when I'm walking. If
41:56
I'm touring or anything, I don't drink
41:59
really at all.
42:02
And when I was in the band,
42:04
it was like to me it felt like it was so
42:07
much bigger than any of us.
42:10
Yeah. that I I kind of felt like I'm not
42:12
going to be the one who it up.
42:16
So I was like now is the time in my life
42:18
when you probably go out and experiment
42:22
and do this and you take this and you do
42:24
that
42:27
cuz it's on your shoulders
42:27
and that's what you do with your
42:28
friends. And I was like I'm not going to
42:29
be the guy who messes it up. So I was
42:31
like I'm not going to do any of that
42:34
stuff.
42:35
making this record felt like I just felt
42:37
so much like so much more joyous and I
42:41
was with my friends and we were in
42:44
Malibu and it was like yeah I felt so
42:46
safe.
42:49
It was like I want to take some
42:50
mushrooms. I'm going to take some like
42:52
now's the time to have fun. Like we're
42:54
in Malibu
42:56
24.
42:57
I'm also in music. I'm not like, do you
42:59
know? It's like, you know, it's like I'm
43:01
You wouldn't be the first musician to
43:04
experiment in that environment.
43:06
I'm not like a politician. I don't think
43:07
it's that crazy.
43:09
I don't think it's that crazy. It's
43:10
definitely not crazy. What is the um Do
43:11
you enjoy it?
43:13
Yeah. I think my thing with with drugs
43:14
is like if you're taking anything to
43:17
escape or to try and hide from stuff,
43:21
then you shouldn't even drink. And if
43:24
you're taking anything to like have fun
43:27
and be creative, then great. And
43:29
I was with my friends and making an
43:34
album, you obviously get so in your head
43:38
and you get so like self-conscious about
43:41
everything and you hit these bumps in
43:43
the road where you're kind of thinking,
43:46
is this good enough? And is it this
43:48
enough? Is it that enough?
43:51
There's like an afterflow of some of
43:53
that stuff where sometimes you take
43:55
something and then for 10 days after
43:58
you're like,
44:00
don't worry about it. Everything's going
44:03
to be fine.
44:05
Like what it it's like kind of stress
44:06
relieving in a sense. And
44:09
and that's where you're at now, I guess,
44:11
in your life as
44:13
as you redefined success and you had fun
44:16
making this album is that you're just
44:18
trying to worry less.
44:20
I think so. Yeah, I think that that's
44:21
like been a big part of the this whole
44:24
thing for me is like I'm just trying to
44:27
go through life being a little less
44:31
worried about stuff. Definitely with
44:34
like working cuz ultimately
44:37
it'll be okay.
44:41
It's like if you don't hit the top of
44:44
the chart, your life doesn't change.
44:46
Like I think realizing that it's like if
44:49
that was what I was aiming at and then
44:52
it didn't happen then I'd feel so much
44:54
worse. But redefining it for me has been
44:57
amazing to be like oh but I'm that's not
45:00
the game I'm playing.
45:03
You did it.
45:05
There's a freedom with that. And
45:05
you know you don't get to go out on
45:08
arena tours with Jenny Lewis if you're
45:10
trying to play the game. You know
45:13
she's so sick.
45:15
She's the best. You don't take Casey
45:16
Musgraves out before she won the Grammy
45:18
if you're trying to like these are bold
45:20
moves. It's obvious how talented Casey
45:22
and Jenny are, but you would be making a
45:25
far more methodical chart based
45:27
decision, you know, taking someone else
45:29
out that would
45:32
fill a different kind of void, you know
45:33
what I mean? In the night, whereas it
45:35
just strikes me that you're making
45:36
decisions based on what's making you
45:37
happy.
45:39
Especially with that stuff, cuz Casey, I
45:41
just love her. her coming on tour was I
45:44
was more thinking of like who do I want
45:47
to watch every night for like 30 shows.
45:50
Yeah.
45:52
You know,
45:53
and you were so dialed in. The timing
45:53
was unbelievable because that album is
45:55
so special
45:56
and then eventually it's like the whole
45:57
world.
45:59
She was booked before the album came
46:00
out,
46:02
which is nuts cuz I just think she's so
46:02
good. Unbelievable.
46:04
You just want to watch people who are
46:06
inspiring and you just want to be around
46:07
like good stuff. I'm just a massive fan
46:10
of her. So when she came out, it was
46:13
really cool for me that she was coming.
46:17
And then obviously the new album came
46:19
out and it was like this is amazing, you
46:20
know? Same with I mean Leon came out
46:24
last time and
46:26
you got KP coming out in the UK.
46:27
She's coming out this time.
46:30
Jenny Lewis coming out in the US. It's
46:31
all dialed in, man. And um this album is
46:32
really it's a it's an amazing listen
46:35
from beginning to end. Covers a lot of
46:38
different ground. really revealing and
46:39
in in a really beautifully written some
46:42
amazing lyrics in there that really kind
46:43
of I haven't heard people put in into
46:45
context before songs like falling and
46:47
you know we talked about cherry and fine
46:49
line the more mellow moments but also
46:51
you know even talking about you know the
46:52
the canyon song where you know you're
46:54
just putting into into you know the idea
46:56
of reflecting and reminiscing on a time
46:58
when it was simple and just really great
47:00
man from beginning to end.
47:02
Thank you.
47:03
Um it's been good to connect and talk to
47:04
you for the first time. Appreciate it.
47:06
It was fun. What are you going to do for
47:07
for the for the Christmas break? I mean,
47:09
you don't start in earnest till next
47:10
year, right?
47:12
I'll be doing something.
47:13
Sure. Probably. Uh Christmas, I go home.
47:15
I go to my mom's.
47:19
Yeah.
47:20
Are you ready for next year, though? I
47:20
mean, do you feel charged up about the
47:22
touring and everything else?
47:23
I'm I'm really excited about it. I think
47:24
it's going to be it. It's my favorite
47:26
part. Um, really even more than I mean
47:28
I've completely fallen in love with
47:32
being in the studio now because of like
47:34
the freedom that comes with it. And I
47:37
think also now I'm kind of
47:38
learning a different way of doing it. I
47:43
think I'd get like chunks in a studio.
47:45
I'd book like a studio for 2 months and
47:48
then I'd go and I'd be in there every
47:51
day cuz I felt like I'd kind of be like,
47:52
well, we've booked it so we have to be
47:55
in there. And I think at some point
47:57
you've written everything that you have
48:00
to write in the moment
48:02
and you realize you're not actually
48:05
living cuz you've just been in the
48:08
studio for 3 months. So I'm kind of
48:09
working out still the balance of like
48:13
next time maybe I'll go in the studio
48:17
for a couple weeks at a time while
48:19
continuing to just kind of live. Are you
48:22
going to act again? Um,
48:24
yeah.
48:28
Anything on the horizon?
48:30
I'd like to. I think for me it's like
48:31
with the acting thing, like I never
48:33
wanted to do it as like just doing it to
48:35
like take a job.
48:39
There was something about like the
48:40
Dunkup thing where when I heard about
48:42
it, I was like, I want to be involved in
48:45
that so bad. I just remember the way
48:48
that it kind of hit me and where I was
48:50
excited to watch it like whether I was
48:53
in it or not. I was like, I can't wait
48:56
to see that.
48:58
You know, if you if you get to make
49:00
stuff that you're passionate about and
49:02
you get to make something that makes you
49:04
happy,
49:06
then you're happy and no one can call
49:08
you unsuccessful, which is great. That's
49:10
the redefinition of success, my man.
49:12
Thanks for your time, bro. Thank you.
49:15
歌词与翻译
[中文]
您为何与加利福尼亚州建立联系？我
的意思是，您可以去机场
并精心挑选世界上的任何地方，然后
在某种程度上再次开始，但您
选择来到这里。
对我来说，老实说，我想我有很多
位亲密朋友都在这里，
位来自伦敦的人因为
工作之类的事情搬到了这里。就像我
说自从我离开家以来，我从来没有
真正拥有过一个让人感觉哦
这就是我的家的地方。我想说我在伦敦的房子
是我觉得最温馨的
嗯。嗯只是因为
我在那里呆的时间最长。我已经
在那里呆了大约 6 年了
以及我们在乐队中
所做的所有巡演和活动。我记得
有一次，我们离开了
这么久，我回到了
英格兰
的家，在家呆了大约5天，我
走进门，坐下来，我
就像
我根本不知道当我
在家时该做什么。我已经离开这么久了。
你不知道我已经很久没见到我的
朋友了。我当时不知道
谁在附近。我有点像
我
这奇怪的现实是什么？是的。所以
我想，在某个时刻，我
意识到我在
路上比
在5天后你做了什么？你
又听到回音了吗？
是的。我很乐意去，你
知道。
我认为这其实是可以理解的。我
认为吉普赛人的生活方式有一些
，特别是
制作旅行音乐的艺术和诸如
的艺术，以及有某种
渴望成为吉普赛人的想法，但由于你的
本质，他们在某种程度上相互吸引
。我的意思是，你
小时候总是有点冒险精神
吗？即使在您成长的过程中，您是否也在进一步寻找
领域？嗯，我
不知道我是不是真的。在我
从未去过伦敦，现在
搬到伦敦之前，我
想到这件事对我来说真是太疯狂了。
这太疯狂了。
你知道，它离我长大的地方
并不远。这就像 3 小时的
车程，但伦敦就像
富人孩子在
周末去购物的地方，比如和他们的妈妈
一起购物，你知道吗？但
关于它的一切都让人感觉
这是一个新的挑战，如果
它带我去伦敦，那么整个
事情对我来说似乎只是一个新的
挑战。从远处观看
，
观看你和你的朋友正在经历
的事情，以及整个
的事情，我的意思是，我想凭借一些智慧和一些年龄的好处
，现在
回顾它，你甚至一定有一个
与2015年第一次结束时略有不同的观点。
已经4了
年，只是想
发生了什么。
是的，这很疯狂，
现在因为有时人们
会提醒我发生的事情
，我忘记了
，而你喜欢重温一遍
，你会有点像，“哦，是的，那
很酷。那也很酷。”你知道，
头两年你甚至感觉不到
你在工作，因为你
很高兴不用去上学
，就像，“哦，我要做这个。
很好。好吧。嗯，你有点从
开始，你知道，当你还是个孩子的时候
，你喜欢看到一个你
想要的T恤，并且你喜欢节省
...
的金额。是的，
但是你必须考虑到
的邮费和包装，所以，你
实际上必须节省
的金额。你知道，你有点像
这样做，然后你搬到伦敦
做一些事情。有趣和
你想，我可以买这件 T 恤吗？
有人说，呃，是的，如果你愿意的话。
你说，好吧。
这感觉就像生活
一样。
是的。然后它就从T恤到
到公寓，从公寓到房子，如果你
知道，你就很幸运能够获得
这样的成功。我的意思是，我
有兴趣了解两个记忆，并且
我们不会在这里停留
太久，因为还有很多东西要谈论
。但是，当我们在这里时，
现在您已经远离了
体验，在 One
普遍记忆是什么？在你的生活
Direction 开始之前您拥有的最强烈的
你脑海中
最清晰、最生动的记忆是什么？是的。在
发生天翻地覆之前，
一切都改变之前，因为它太突然了。我的意思是
已经过去了10周，
突然就这样了。你不会
你不会再回家了。
是的。我的意思是，可能就像我和我以前住在
餐。嗯，
中餐馆旁边的一些人一起吃的生日
就像我最喜欢的餐厅。
所以我过去每
天放学回家。我会走到我的卧室，打开
窗户并将头伸出来。
闻一闻。
哇！你知道，呃，那就像
，我去那里吃生日餐。但是
我想说我想说最大的
东西可能是一条
河流。房子叫River Dane，
你知道每个人都会在
夏天去那里，你会买那些小
一次性烧烤炉。你过去拿
，有人负责
买香肠，有人
买饮料
地板烧烤。
是的。你喜欢把它们放在地板上
，然后你尝试以某种方式将
12根香肠挤到这个像
一样的小东西上。
嗯，好的。您今天对此最有
的记忆是什么？是
四年吗？
五。
五年。
是的。
真正
跳出来的是什么？
我最喜欢的回忆之一。
我给你两个。第一个是
，当时我们刚刚组建乐队。
就像我们在
拍摄的照片。就像某人的妈妈拿走了它一样。
演出时
就像我们的第一张照片
是我们五个人。我们住在
我继父的家里。我们就像
住在这个小平房里，我们所有人
一起喜欢练习，我们
只是喜欢唱歌，基本上
只是睡了大约4天，
每个人都开车下来，
小呃，像新闻代理，我们听说这张照片
街上有一个小小的
被登在报纸上。所以我们就像，
“哦，我们要上报纸了。”
太疯狂了。所以，我们五个人
像w一样离开了这间小平房
，走到新闻代理处，
拿到了报纸，然后回来吃了
早餐，我们都像
坐着盯着报纸，
传递报纸，我们就像，
“让我再看看它。让我再看看它
。”
呃我不知道。我想只是因为我们
不知道会发生什么
。
这是一幅永恒的图像。这是永恒的
图像。
我们对此感到非常高兴。当你
真正的认识。就像
意识到这不再是
受控环境时，第一个
在
街上你不认识的人实际上可以看你一眼
或听到你是
，这对于我
改变生活的时刻。
尊重的每一位艺术家来说无疑是一个
是的，因为它也只发生一次。
哦，在那之后
一切都发生了变化。
是的，因为我们在家里观看 X
Factor。我的试镜
表弟家
播出的那天，我们在我的
，你知道我们看了它，我们
说，“天啊，这太疯狂了。”
然后我们开车回家，去一家
加油站停下来加油
，我在加油站，这个
家伙说，“你刚刚参加了X Factor吗？”
我当时想，
“是的，我是。”
嗯，但是，是的，我会这么说。然后
另一首，我想一旦乐队
真正开始，我们就在瑞典
在
录音室录制《What Makes You Beautiful》，
有人走进房间，
说，“外面有两个女孩。”
然后我们就想，“为什么？”
他们会说，“他们
正在找你。”我们都只是
，“但我们在瑞典。”
你知道，所以这就像另一个
一样。是的。
是的。我的意思是，
这有点像，“天哪，
这太疯狂了。”就像，“我们在
瑞典。你怎么知道，快进
到最后，
几个月后你就来到了这里，就像
减压导致第一张专辑
的写作，对吗？进入
你的同名专辑。嗯
第一次拥有一些独立性的想法
真的可以做任何你想做的事情
感觉怎么样？
呃
实际上，当我想要
...
制作唱片时，我并没有什么计划。
嗯，这就是我来到这里的原因，
...
是我们的第一首歌。
...
就是这样。就像我第一次写
会议一样，当时我有点像
那样开始，因为在那之前我已经与不同的人进行了
很多会议
并且
我尝试与尽可能多的不同
人一起写作，只是为了感觉
只是喜欢学习。我只是想
学习。这就像我
听过的歌曲创作描述的最好方式就像
，有点像冲浪，你
可以按照自己的意愿练习在板上起身
，有时波浪
只是没有来，或者波浪来了，但
你没有足够练习在
板上起身。时不时地，当你
练习得足够多时，浪潮就会到来，
那就是你
写那首歌的时候。
就在那时
发生了。那时音乐
一切都在正确的位置。所以，我
一直想做好准备，每当
就站起来。你冲浪吗？
浪潮到来时，
还不够。我希望我能多冲浪。我
实际上这里的波浪真的
非常强烈。我想我上次冲浪
就是在这里，我
彻底被打败了。我一直像
一样翻来覆去。
太糟糕了。
是的。我的意思是，它看起来很漂亮
，直到你进入水中并
意识到你的深度有点超出了
的深度。嗯，当您刚开始
友谊对您来说有多重要？因为你正在尝试
时，
，就像你说的，你尝试了很多
不同的歌曲作者，但我觉得
就像当专辑最终发行时，
你发现了一群紧密的朋友，他们
不仅仅是合作者。我想说的是，当我
结束这个想法，这有点
在乐队中创作时，我想说
，就像我曾经写过
只是和朋友或其他人一起写的东西，
有点像，好吧，我不会
发行任何音乐，但是如果我要写一首
听起来会是什么样子？
适合我的歌曲，
这是合同规定还是
只是对乐队的忠诚？
只是不太想这么做。
是的。嗯
肯定没有时间。
是的。正确的。
但我知道也许有一天我会
想要这样做，但我并不是说我不能
等待摆脱这件事，这样我就可以
去制作自己的唱片。
是的。
你知道。
那么，你是否已经想到了它的结局？
一点点。好吧，我不会说
爬了上去。我想在最后一年，我们
都知道我们将在
年底停止。
那么，你怎么知道？我的意思是，你知道，
这就是这个庞然大物。简直就是
不间断。
好吧，我们希望坐下来
进行对话，讨论
大家都好，每个人都想继续
之类的事情。
我的一部分
我觉得我
作为一个成年人所做的所有决定影响了
我的生活，以及我
在我的生活中所做的事情都是作为一个
群体做出的。我认为
我的一部分感觉我想为自己做出一些
决定，就像
你从来没有真正需要做出
决定，因为我可以把我的
帽子放在戒指上，但仍然像哦
多数人规则一样，我被否决了。
我觉得我需要做出一些
决定，这些决定
只会影响我。你知道，Zayn 已经
做到了这一点，他在巡演中途退出，
我认为你们
为粉丝们见证了那场巡演，真是太棒了。我认为
对于
人来说，这可能是一个不稳定的 24 小时，他们认为，好吧，
即将开始一些事情。
但现在回想起来，
完成那次
巡演并坚持到底是多么具有挑战性，
你知道，
决定不看
到底对他有多大影响？是的，我的意思是
呃我的意思是这很难，你知道。
部分原因是，我们
显然为某人
离开而感到悲伤，但也为他
不那么享受它而感到悲伤，以至于他不得不
离开，因为我想当时也是
巡演，一切都进展顺利
好，我们每个人都
到达了这个地方，每个人
都以一种我认为
他们感受到的方式生活相当不错，同时
喜欢享受是的，感觉每个人
都有点享受它，嗯，是的，我
说很大一部分是我们
的感觉，“哇，我们没有意识到他
不太喜欢它。”你知道，
你知道，显然有一个重要的
，对我们来说有一些重要的时刻，我们
会问，“我们在做什么？”你
知道，因为我们正要开始
录制一张新专辑和其他东西，而
就像，
“我们只是在没有他的情况下录制这个
吗？”但我想说，
我想我们四个人变得
更亲密了。
嗯，因为我们当时想，“好吧，这是我们没有预料到的
障碍。”我
认为，当你
不同的地方处理这个问题，这是
工作时，比如旅行和游览，你会在许多
一件要求很高的事情，并不是每个人都喜欢
这样做，但这有点像如果
有人不喜欢它，你宁愿
他们
不这样做。这就是为什么合同对我来说
很奇怪。就像我理解的那样，当涉及大量资金时，
就会渴望去做这些事情，特别是当
...
有某些业务
确实有效时，但在艺术
和创造性的事情中，比如我
从来不理解让人们违背
他们的意愿。就像你不会得到
好的工作一样。
我从来没有像记录中那样明白
处理类似
的事情，你为什么会知道像
这样的人不会解除合同
之类的。这就像为什么你想要
为什么你会想要一个嫉妒的雇主
像艺术家一样为你做东西
当他们不想做东西时？对我来说
似乎完全适得其反
，但我的意思是，
你知道，
我也不是商人。所以，
你在
部门做得很好。所以，您有一些
良好的直觉。你知道，你雇佣了好吧，
我不知道是否可能
我会说我的直觉是我
在人方面唯一信任
的东西。
这真的很重要，对吧？我的意思是，
只有两条规则是您真正应该
遵守的。直觉和勤奋，对吗？
有人带你进入房间。第二个
会让您仔细检查并确保#{20}您应该留在那里。我也可以告诉
...
，因为我曾经
真的很被人们感到不安
是的。
是当我对自己感到更加不安的时候
我做错了
因为我觉得我真的很喜欢
我觉得我对
角色
很有判断力，那是我唯一一次感觉自己
对这样的事情感到非常不安
你会说，“哦，我信任这个
人或者你知道我觉得
它们是一件好事。”然后事情就变成了
，你就好像我
搞错了，然后我就
真的为此感到沮丧了一段时间。
是的。是的。老实说，这是典型的
自己难受综合症。
你知道，拿别人的 [ __ ]
并为此责怪自己。就是
这是疗法101。疗法101。你
尝试过那种疗法吗？
我喜欢它。
嗯，是的，我确实有。是的，
我喜欢它。是的。我认为在
很长一段时间里，尤其是当我开始
来到加利福尼亚时，
对我来说是一件大事，我
感觉每个人都去接受治疗。
他们确实，
对吧？我想很长一段时间我
都想，我不需要那个。你知道，
我认为这很像英国人看待
的方式。然后我认为
有一个时刻，我试图
找出更多关于我自己的东西
，因为显然当时我只是
在做
你自己的事情。是的。
嗯
，我认为当
你尝试创作音乐时，你就会
所以海军凝视。你就像
，我觉得制作一张专辑是你能想到的
最自我放纵的
一次，因为
你就像
哦，如果你没有机会
分享它，如果你没有真正完成
并与我们分享
，那将是最史诗般的自恋
订单。
你能想象你只是制作了一张
专辑，然后就不发行它吗？
我想这是一种奇怪的治疗方式
但后来我们得到了交易。这就是
我们得到的就是我们得到的交易。
当
你把它放进去时，我们会得到那种海军般的凝视，而自我反思
不知何故形成了这种神奇的形状，
我们可以将其应用到我们自己的生活中，
然后我们变得自恋，因为我们
说哈利对我说得好
所以我可以应用到她身上，但是是的
我想我认为通过治疗，我
刚刚意识到我只是以自己的方式进入
，你知道这件事
我确实感觉到它对我的生活产生了影响
，并且我
向一些正在经历一些事情的朋友介绍了一些
的朋友，他们对此非常
持怀疑态度。
我认为你是一个好朋友。
你是一个忠诚的人。
努力做到。
是的。那么，谁是您最好的
朋友呢？谁是帮助
你度过这段时期的人？这是您真正认识的
人
你很接近。我很幸运
实际上有这些东西，因为
这可能就是为什么我没有早点去
治疗的原因是因为
我有那些朋友，在那里我可以进行
与我与
治疗师进行的对话相同的对话。我参加了这次演讲
，艾伦·德波顿 (Alan Debotton) 正在演讲，他
正在谈论真正的
友谊是如何建立在
脆弱性之上的。当你向
某人敞开心扉时，
你才真正了解某人。所以，如果有人是我的朋友，
，我肯定会
，并且我感觉哦，我
想要与他们保持亲密关系，只需立即打开
即可。
这样做肯定会让我
与
这样的人变得更加亲密，我想说的是，我所有的朋友都是
。
当您
开始在 Fine Line 上制作这张新的
专辑时，您感觉如何？您对自己的同名首张专辑
看法有改变吗？在从 One Direction 出来并
的
，您在
的最激烈时刻感受到了哪些事情，而您会以不同的方式
制作一张个人唱片的过程中
做，或者您认为专辑
没有完全实现？
嗯，当我现在喜欢听第一张
专辑时，我可以听到所有
的地方，我觉得自己在谨慎行事
，因为我只是不想弄错。
我只是不想弄错。所以，
你从一首中速7分钟
单曲开始了，兄弟。我的意思是，公平地说，
并不那么安全。
是的。呃，除此之外，
继续。
但是，嗯，我想
进入这张专辑的一个重要部分是我花了很多
时间来思考你制作一张专辑的整个
过程，然后你
把它推出，你知道，
发行它，然后你巡演它。以及所有我不太喜欢的
部分，
我进入了第二个
，感觉我想弄清楚如何
让这一切变得非常有趣。
这就是为什么你喝玛格丽塔酒
并做蘑菇。
是的。是的。我想我认为这是
种哞哞声。
我想我有过这样的时刻
，就像我宁愿不做也不愿做
，而且这并不有趣。制作这张专辑
完全是为了自由。是的，当然。
听起来不错。
我想在
这张唱片的整个制作过程中我度过了一个重要的时刻。长期以来，我
试图重新定义成功
对我来说意味着什么，尤其是在
乐队中。就好像每张专辑都变得
更大，每次巡演都变得更大，而
就像一直在增长。我认为
当我去制作第一张唱片时，
是一种自由，因为我觉得，
好吧，我不必再这样做了。
你仍然会说，“好吧，如果最后一个
乐队的事情是这个，然后你的第一个
事情，
哦，每个人都在排队评判。
每个人都在排队评判。”就像，
你推出了第一张专辑，
它并没有粉碎它。
就像，“哦，好吧，我想在
乐队中，这是一个 nogo。”正确的。
对。
对我来说，当这张专辑发行时，
我觉得你已经
用你自己的方式重新定义了成功
，因为你与你的
观众建立了联系。对我来说，至少像
这样一种非常真实的想法，就像他回到
，试图与
人真正建立联系。您无法在
棒球场进行连接，
，对吧？
这是我一直说的一件事，当我们
...
开始时，当我们开始制作
音乐时，就像
对我的经理说，就像
第一次巡演一样，我希望它
非常小，然后我想在
这个中，我只是想
玩得开心。我只是想拥有这么多
有趣。
这就是成功。这就是您
重新定义成功的地方。
是的。我的一位朋友
说，“如果你很高兴做你正在做的事情
，那么没有人会告诉你你
不成功。”
我的意思是，这很明显，但这也是
可能在四年
年前的事情，如果有人对
我这么说，我会说，“好吧，
因为你太忙于让每个人
开心了。”而且，我想当我
在乐队时，有一件大事
，因为我们会制作我们在路上制作的最后三张
唱片，并且
我有朋友是音乐家，我
认识他们希望他们进行巡演，然后
他们会花6个月的时间去制作
a Yeah。进入一个过程。
我曾经说过，“天哪，
你能做到。”
好吧，所以你就像
所做的那样。
你这就是你所做的一切。
您现在在 6067 号房间。您只是在香港万豪酒店制作
，周围是
，周围有
四个床垫和一个在上面的床垫。
是的，没错。
嗯，在最后两次巡演中，我们
买了这个像旧监控车
一样的东西，并将其改造成工作室，这样
就可以跟随巡演。因此，就像在
场地一样，您会进入这辆没有空调的
小型监控车。
。
你在 One Direction 中会在
后面去，我们在路上一辆货车的
后面录制了歌曲。
所以我们有
那是最专横的[ __ ] 是的。看吧，
路过货车的人
对此一无所知。
嗯，就像在会场一样。
在会场吧？好的。
嗯，太疯狂了。
这样记录下来很有趣。这只是一个完全不同的过程
。
这张专辑以金色开头，这
就像你之前所说的那样，脆弱性
是通往伟大友谊的道路，我
感觉那首歌证实了这一点。我
的意思是，有很多类似的说法，我知道
你很害怕，但是伙计，我只是要
告诉你真相。
我觉得这就是那首歌
的主题。这也为专辑
奠定了基础。这是一张非常
的个人专辑。我们是在香格里拉的
第二天写的《金色》。
就像我们一完成
就立即感觉的那样，“哦，这就是
是第一轨。”
你知道的。我喜欢那种感觉。
制作唱片的最佳部分之一
就是随时制作曲目列表。
因为我总是以第一首曲目和
最后一首曲目结束，然后你会说，
“好吧，让我们看看什么
所以你知道 Fine Line 将是最后一首
曲目。”
是的。一旦我们这样做，
你知道，专辑标题就是
。
不。
这是一首非常有力的音乐。如果您愿意，我们
可以跳到最后。这就是
，就像那是我今年
最喜欢的歌曲之一。我的意思是，这真是一个
令人惊叹的事情，伙计。嗯 Golden 来得非常早
，然后我常常从这里开车
去录音室听它，
就像我们刚拥有它一样，
Golden 就像一首完美的 BCH 歌曲。
魔法，
你知道吗？这就像沿着
海岸行驶。这正是歌曲
的目的。对我来说
那首歌感觉很马里布。我听说你播放整张专辑的第一个人是 Liam
。这是真的吗？
Gallagher。
最早的人之一。
呃，是的，我猜是偶然的。
那么，发生了什么？
嗯，他在，呃，我们在伦敦的一个
工作室工作，他在
，我们有点想完成
，他在隔壁的工作室。他
进来了，我不记得
是怎么发生的，但他最后就
是的，这是他第一次
就在那里听着，
这太疯狂了。你知道，我从小就是
绿洲乐队的忠实粉丝。然后
他邀请我们大家去听
他的唱片，我们听了，我们都
喜欢吃鱼和薯条，聊天等等
，他真的很酷。
我想西瓜糖
对他来说会是一个突出的人物。我不知道
为什么。感觉这就是他的
氛围。那是我什至不知道我们是否
哦，是的。也许我们在那玩过。但是
这些东西都没有
完成。我认为上面还没有角
。
对。
亮起我认为没有写。
点亮、崇拜你、善待他人，以及
呃，是的，我认为这三项
还没有完成。上周他们基本上都是
。西瓜
糖，嗯，此时已经出炉了，
你在《SNL》上表演过。嗯，每个人
都知道它的意思了。呃
，你知道，
相互欣赏口头愉悦的乐趣。
嗯
是这样的吗？
是吗？
我不知道。
大家都这么说。
哦，
让
解释保持开放总是好的。
是的，当然。是的。
嗯，但这似乎
一直跟着你。
你不仅是一个性感的象征，
而且你的很多音乐都受到了
的启发。
这很不舒服。
是的，我想。但我实际上想
问你一个真正严肃的问题
，因为人们把它
当作食物一样扔来扔去，但实际上
很尴尬，对吗？就像有时候，当人们从这个角度来看
？
时，你感觉如何？
老实说，我会说我尝试尽可能少地思考
，因为
这是一个非常奇怪的动态事物。
嗯，这也很奇怪
想想你自己。完全。就像，
嗯，
我想
中的性行为就像以前一样，让我感觉
更多的禁忌，甚至喜欢
当我们在乐队时，就像
人们认为我发生性关系的想法
一样，“哦不，那太疯狂了。”就像，“如果他们知道怎么办
？”但这就像，
你知道吗？
是的。因此，即使就像进入
这张唱片一样，我也想感觉自己
不再那么拘谨。我希望
感到更自由、更快乐
并且喜欢诚实。
我认为很多时候
有类似小报的报道，例如
类似的人分手了，你知道
我认为人们忘记了
有一个人也
与某人分手
，这是令人悲伤的。就像
一样，当你与
某人分手时，你会感到难过。
是的，这张专辑在
部分给我的感觉，如果我太个人化，请原谅，
但基于音乐，在某些方面感觉像是一张
分手唱片。
这一首特别的歌曲就像一首名为 Cherry 的歌曲
，这首歌
很疯狂。我的意思是，切入正题，你
知道，有一些真实的图像，嗯
失去某人给别人，而
仍然是你们关系的残余
进入一个
新空间，这正是
心碎的核心。我的意思是，
这就像最具毁灭性的
图片之一，如果你足够幸运
你心碎的话。这是您可以看到的
最具破坏性的图像之一
。而且你也非常具体，
你知道，就我而言
来说，它非常具体地提到了
你所经历的关系。
是的。是的。这对我来说有点像
很奇怪，因为我总是喜欢，
你知道，我不
喜欢解释歌曲或喜欢
解释一下它们背后的含义
之类的。但我认为有了
这张唱片，它就更加开放了。
是的。
就像，
但你在
中告诉我们是的。
就像它告诉你它是什么一样，你知道吗？
我认为我喜欢这张唱片的
，尤其是与上一张相比，
...
就像当我开始制作一张专辑时，我
不觉得，哦，我正在制作一张专辑
，我将在明年
十二月发行，或者感觉就像我刚刚开始
写一些歌曲，然后我
可以尽可能诚实。然后
当你决定是否
认为它太诚实时，就是你
将其发布的时候。我从来不想
削减那些东西。所以，当你稍后听
想过一秒钟，我们会
Cherry 的声音时，你从来没有
进行对话，或者其他人
会听它并试图
破译它，以及这会让你
有何感受。你觉得你想要忠于
它。
我想我想忠实于它。我
认为在我写下它的那一刻，我
想要忠实于我
写下它的那一刻以及我当时的感受。还有
与
相关的事情，那么你感觉怎么样？
不太好。
但我想也是在我
感觉我意识到
的一些事情都是
更加开放和
你知道不是我不在乎的一部分。
当您
知道什么时候事情没有按照您想要的方式进行时，
就好像您变得狭隘了。就像你
对这些东西很吝啬。我认为
Cherry 有一些东西
在某种程度上它是如此可悲。
...
我写这篇文章的那天晚上，我们已经写了
周了，
每个人都呃离开了工作室。原来是
我、呃 Tyler 和 Sammy，他是我们的
工程师。我们大概在
周围聊天。我说我
凌晨 2:00 左右坐在
感到很大的压力，因为
最后一张唱片不像广播
唱片。
...
将这些歌曲制作得像大歌一样，我感到压力很大。
我当时想，我觉得这张
唱片一定很大。所以我觉得
我需要制作某些歌曲。
你知道，我对想要制作的
条记录有所有这些想法。我希望
在 5 年内创造这个记录。我希望
在 10 年内制作这张唱片，并且我
想要为我想要制作的
唱片制作这些想法。我们
进行了这次对话，泰勒对
我说，
“你只需录制你现在想要录制的唱片
。就这样。
没有什么，让我确保这张
在商业上取得成功，以便我以后能够
制作我想要的东西。”
嗯，你只需要做你现在想要做的记录
。
他是对的。
所以那天晚上我们熬夜写了《Cherry》
。
那么
你怎么样所以当你写
它时你感觉很糟糕。当你完成
后感觉如何？
太好了。就像我非常喜欢它一样。
这是谁？最后发言的是谁？
最后的声音是什么？
那是我的前女友。
是的。这很有趣。我认为
你把它留在
中是非常酷的，显然是从某种图像角度
的角度来看的，因为我喜欢所有这些东西。我
喜欢听围绕
音乐的事情，而不一定只是
与结构联系在一起。
但是，你知道，你的
前女友在
歌曲结尾处说话的决定是如此直率和直接
就像你
脑子里的想法一样。就像其他刚刚破碎的人一样
现在和某人在一起就好像不在
你最疯狂的一天我会这样做吗？
是的，我知道。呃我不知道。我认为
就像是因为它后来被添加到
中，感觉就像是歌曲的一部分。只是
感觉它需要它。我们是朋友
之类的，所以我问她是否可以
，她同意了。
她觉得这首歌怎么样？
嗯，我想她喜欢它。来吧，伙计。
上面有写过，对吧？你必须
走，你一定会喜欢
这一天结束时的感觉，伙计。我的意思是，嗯，有一首歌
叫做《Falling on the Record》，
第一次听到这首歌时，我觉得每个人
都有缺陷，但它是真正的
杰出作品。它将成为
我认为人们会随身携带的东西
，无论
专辑的背景如何。他们会以自己的方式将这首歌归零为
。嗯，汤姆
告诉我，那件事来得
超级快。
嗯。
我想我要出去吃晚饭，
有人从汤姆的
家接我。所以，他来接我，我
正在洗澡，他就像在弹
钢琴，当我从
淋浴出来时，他就像弹d一样。
我去
钢琴前站在他旁边，只裹着一条毛巾，我们只是
写下了整件事。那么
真的是
多久了？花了多长时间？
我想说跌倒可能需要
大约 20 分钟。
我的意思是用毛巾捂住 20 分钟。
这才是真正的友谊。
是的，就是
是的，没错。
3 天。
好的，我们完成了。请去给我们穿上
一些裤子。
这就是那些时刻之一，对吧，
冲浪的比喻
其中
波浪和练习
全部结合在一起。
你认为它们来自哪里？
主题如果来得这么快的话。
嗯
你认为你在说什么
那首歌？我现在正在回听。
我想对我来说，
之前没有真正经历过的事情是在
制作这张唱片的过程中，当我
感觉良好、感到快乐的时候，就像是我一生中
感受到的最快乐的时光。
当我感到悲伤的时候，就像是我一生中经历过的最低谷。我
...
认为这是一种
那种感觉，当你感觉
自己有点回到
那些时刻时，你
在那里，副歌说我现在
是什么？我是一个我不想要的人吗？
有点像
是的，它很强大。是超级
自我陶醉和自我放纵在
一种类似自我的方式
有点我想这是一个重要的时刻
我有点问自己
我是谁，我在做什么
并且那里有
喝得太醉和手游走的图像，所有
这些东西都让所有的内疚
点
是的，就像
我开始感觉像
的线索，你们知道我在哪里可以看到自己
成为一个我不想
成为
的人，呃，这真的很难。但我
认为
的好处是你可以写一首关于它的歌曲
，然后说，“好吧，下一个。”
你知道吗，
在那些时刻谁会帮助你？
你的妈妈仍然扮演着非常重要的
角色，你的家庭吗？顺便说一句，你
不一定是你自己。
在各行各业中，有些人做着各种各样的
事情，却
迷失了方向，需要人们
让他们回归正轨。所以，
让我们暂时谈谈这种关系
，因为我知道家庭对你来说
很重要。
我想我和我的家人在一起很幸运。
他们一直都非常
支持，这对你们所有人来说都是善意的
...
可以像这样做一样要求
显然
你知道有时你不想
回家，就像我现在很痛苦
因为你想表现得不一样，我很好
别担心我
这也会发生，而且
与我的家人保持关系
如果我需要进行
对话，我可以
你妈妈
给你的最好的建议是什么？
我妈妈的问题是，她不像
那样，她不像
的建议。她更像是我认识的
最善良的女人，你知道吗？所以对于
我来说，总是就像只是看着
她与人和事相处的方式
就像她只是我不认为她
有一根坏骨头，这是一件
不可思议的事情，在周围长大
有那个人喜欢支持你是
嗯，这太棒了。她是最好的。她实际上是
最好的。那么你
最想念谁？你希望谁仍然
在身边？
可能是我的继父。
继父几年前去世了。
嗯，
这很难。
他非常棒。他就像一个
非常好的人。
是的。当你
的生活中学到了什么？因为我们都有
经历失落时，你从
要跨过那座桥，
是的，
这有点发人深省，然后
当成年真正敲响你的
门，你开始真正利用
优势并优先考虑
事情。你知道
从你
辛烷值的童年的另一端出来，进入你的第二张专辑，
进入20多岁
的那个非常非常高
成为一个独立的人，
与你的
家庭有很强的关系，比如
你的优先事项如何改变，
真正
发生的事情是什么现在为你聚焦
友谊对我来说可能是最
重要的事情，就像
我真正亲近的人一样，我想说
对我来说比任何事情都重要
其他
我在与朋友的
对话中确实感受到了不同。
我想，因为当你还是个孩子的时候，当你失去
。
祖父母或其他什么的时候，你更喜欢经历死亡
是的。
这真的很悲伤，但也就像
哦，祖父母是最先死去的人
。
这就是
的一些自然顺序。
是的。嗯
我认为当你第一次像朋友一样失去
时
是当你真正感觉自己像个成年人的时候。
你会觉得“哇”。
我认为，这是因为这是您最初的
经历之一，
是您失去控制的地方。完全失去控制。
你知道，我认为你有那些
时刻，每个人
都会经历这样的时刻，每个人 都会失去一个朋友，
其中，
你知道，无论你是否与他们关系密切
，我认为每个人都有
这样的事情，
我希望我能再问一次
他们是否还好，你知道吗？如果说
有任何积极的事情可能
产生的话，那就是
现在我与
朋友关于这些事情的对话是
不同的，就像，
你知道，你问一个朋友他们是否
还好。就像，是的，是的，我
很好。你会说，我
已经做好了准备，不，但是你
知道，
把名单给我。
你其实很好。
给我名单。你知道，这
就像我现在和我的朋友
的对话一样。
而你也以自己的方式
同样脆弱。而且你可以回去。
当然。
我认为这确实
很重要。显然，
就像我之前所说的，就像真实的一样
友谊来自
，我不认为每个人都足够幸运
拥有它。我不认为
总是发生。如此有趣的
，以至于你知道自己从这段
经历中走出来，这段经历让很多人
孤立、恐惧、偏执，
不想与人类精神联系
，因为多年来他们一直被不间断的人类
精神包围，
对吧？而你却如此与众不同。
就好像您只是在其上调用了时间
，然后几乎立即
真实的人类体验。您知道，您来到
去搜索
加利福尼亚州是为了寻找人才，
是为了体验和
是的。
以及人际关系。我的意思是
我与加州的关系是
，就像过去几年
也确实发生了变化，但当我第一次来到
这里时，感觉就像哦，如果你搬到
这里，那就意味着你已经做到了
做得很好。我的意思是公平的。
是的，但这是我的房子。
但是，呃，你知道你会得到这样的感觉
，它在电影中随处可见
，你会觉得哦，这太神奇了
，就像你在其中，
你会来到这里
，我想我在这里度过的时间越多，我
就想，哦，不，实际上，如果你可以来这里
，然后离开，那就是当你感觉
真的很棒。如果您像哦，是的
，那就太棒了。
两个月后见。
一会儿见。是的。但这
又回到了你所说的
，你让我觉得你是一个
焦躁不安的人。
是的。我的意思是，这里的事情就像
我在洛杉矶从来没有感到宾至如归，
从某种意义上来说，这不是很好，但
同时，当我在这里时，我总是感觉
正在度假。
是的，这很公平。
所以我真的很喜欢在这里。很多
我最亲密的朋友都在这里
我通常感觉最好的时候是
能看到那些人。所以，当这种
的谈话自然结束
，当太阳在
我们在一起的时间落下时，嗯
伦敦对你来说是什么，如果那是
离家最近的地方？
嗯
伦敦就像我将来想去的地方
。这很奇怪
，因为在旅行了这么多次之后，我不
认为我对未来的看法不会像
我会住在这个地方，
然后我永远不会搬到任何地方。我认为
这就像快乐一样。我只是
想要快乐。如果
那么你是吗？
如果我现在感觉很好的话。是的。
你制作这张专辑很开心吗？
呃是的，太有趣了。
制作
这张专辑时最有趣的回忆是什么？我想说，我的
最喜欢的记忆可能是制作这
之一，至少是我们写
Golden 的那一天。
我们停下来去吃晚饭，
我们都坐在
香格里拉
的厨房里，我们就像用
一把吉他弹奏它一样，每个人都围着桌子唱
它，
感觉真的很好。好像感觉
比上次快乐多了。
我认为这是有道理的，因为就像
你所说的，第一首单曲是一首七
分钟的钢琴民谣。所以，
表现得真正
快乐会很奇怪。
但是
你继续前进。
哦，是的，
仍然超速。
是的，继续。
好的，太棒了。嗯，我认为
对我来说像蘑菇一样的事情
的一部分是我在工作时
从来不做任何事情。
嗯。
还有
我什至走路时都不喝酒。如果
我在巡演或其他什么事情，我根本不会喝
。
当我在乐队中时，
对我来说感觉就像是
比我们任何人都大得多。
是的。我有点觉得我不会
成为那个人。
所以我想现在是我生命中的
时间，你可能会出去尝试
，做这个，你做这个，你做
那个
，因为它在你的肩膀上
，这就是你和你的
朋友所做的事情。我当时想我不会
成为把事情搞砸的人。所以我
好像我不会做任何
的事情。
制作这张唱片的感觉就像是我感觉
如此多的快乐，我
和我的朋友们在一起，我们在
马里布，就像是的，我感觉如此
安全。
就像我想要一些
蘑菇。我要带一些像
这样的东西，现在是玩得开心的时候了。就像我们
在马里布
24。
我也从事音乐行业。我不喜欢，你
知道吗？就像，你知道，就像我
你不会是第一个在那种环境中进行
实验的音乐家。
我不像政客。我不认为
有那么疯狂。
我不认为这有那么疯狂。这
绝对不疯狂。你喜欢什么
？
是的。我认为我对毒品的态度
就像如果你服用任何东西来
逃避或试图躲避东西，
那么你甚至不应该喝酒。如果
您所做的一切都是为了享受乐趣
并发挥创意，那就太好了。
我和我的朋友们一起制作了一张
专辑，你显然在你的脑海里
，你对
所有的事情都很不自在，你在
路上遇到了这些坎坷，你在想，
这足够好吗？这
够了吗？这样就够了吗？
这就像一些
的后流，有时你服用
一些东西，然后在
后的 10 天里，你会说，
不要担心。一切都会好起来的
。
就像某种压力
在某种意义上得到缓解。和
，我想，这就是你现在的处境，
在你的生活中
，因为你重新定义了成功，并且你在制作这张专辑时
玩得很开心，因为你只是
试图减少担心。
我想是的。是的，我认为这
对我来说是整个
事情的重要组成部分，就像我只是想
在生活中少一点
担心事情。绝对是
喜欢工作，因为最终
会没事的。
就好像如果您没有登上图表顶部
，您的生活就不会改变。
就像我想意识到，如果
这就是我的目标，然后
它没有发生，那么我会感觉更糟
。但对我来说重新定义它
真是太棒了，因为我会说哦，但这不是
我正在玩的游戏。
你做到了。
这就是一种自由。
你知道，如果你
竞技场之旅。你知道
尝试玩这款游戏，你就无法与 Jenny Lewis 一起参加
她病得很厉害。
她是最棒的。如果你想喜欢这些大胆的
穆斯格雷夫斯赢得格莱美
之前，你就不会把她淘汰。很明显凯西
举动，那么在凯西
和珍妮有多么有才华，但你会做出一个
更加有条理的基于图表的
决定，你知道，把其他人
排除在外，这会
填补不同类型的空白，你知道
我的意思吗？在晚上，
让我惊讶的是，你正在根据让你
决定。
快乐的事情做出
尤其是那些东西，因为凯西，我
就是爱她。她即将参加巡演，我
更多地考虑的是我希望
每天晚上观看大约30场演出。
是的。
你知道，
，你是如此的投入。
的时机令人难以置信，因为那张专辑
如此特别
，最终它就像整个
世界。
她在专辑发行之前就被预订了
，
这太疯狂了，因为我只是觉得她
太棒了。难以置信。
您只是想看到那些
鼓舞人心的人，并且您只是想和
一样的好东西在一起。我只是她的超级粉丝
。所以当她出来时，她的到来对我来说真的很酷
。
然后显然新专辑
出来了，感觉太棒了，你
知道吗？与我的意思相同，Leon 上次出炉
，
你在英国出炉了 KP。
她这次要出来了。
Jenny Lewis 在美国出柜。已经
全部拨通了，伙计。嗯，这张专辑
真的是一个令人惊叹的聆听
从头到尾。涵盖了许多
不同的领域。真的很有启发性，
在写得非常漂亮的一些
令人惊叹的歌词中，非常友善
我没有听到人们在像坠落之类的歌曲之前将其放入
上下文中，
你知道我们谈论了樱桃和细线
更柔和的时刻，但也
你知道甚至谈论你知道
峡谷歌曲，你知道你正在
刚刚放入其中你知道
的想法是反思和回忆一个
的时代，当时它很简单，而且从头到尾都非常伟大
。
谢谢。
嗯，第一次与
你联系和交谈真是太好了。欣赏它。
很有趣。圣诞节假期你打算为
做什么？我的意思是，
你要到明年
年才会认真开始，对吧？
我要做点什么。
当然。大概。嗯，圣诞节，我回家了。
我去我妈妈家。
是的。
不过，您准备好迎接明年了吗？我
的意思是，你对
巡演和其他一切感到兴奋吗？
我对此感到非常兴奋。我想
就是这样了。这是我最喜欢的
部分。嗯，真的比我的意思
我已经完全爱上了
现在在工作室是因为
随之而来的自由。我
认为我现在也
学习一种不同的做法。我
认为我会在工作室里得到很多东西。
我会像工作室一样预订 2 个月，
然后我会去，每
天我都会去那里，因为我觉得我会说，
好吧，我们已经预订了，所以我们必须
在那里。我认为在某个时刻
你已经写下了
那一刻要写的所有内容
，然后你意识到你实际上并没有
活着，因为你刚刚在
工作室呆了3个月。所以我
仍然在努力保持
的平衡，下次也许我会去工作室
一次几周，同时
继续进行现场表演。你
还要再演戏吗？嗯，
是的。
有什么即将发生的事情吗？
我愿意。我认为对我来说，这就像
与表演的事情一样，就像我从来没有
想要这样做，就像只是为了
去做一份工作一样。
有一些类似
Dunkup 的事情，当我听说
时，我就想，我太想参与
了。我只记得
它对我的打击，以及我
兴奋地观看它，就像我是否
在其中一样。我当时想，我等不及
看到这个了。
你知道，如果你能够制作
你热衷的东西，并且
你能够制作让你
快乐的东西，
那么你就快乐了，没有人可以说
你不成功，这很棒。这就是
成功的重新定义，老兄。
感谢您抽出时间，兄弟。谢谢。
[英语]
Show
重点词汇
开始练习
| 词汇 | 含义 |
|---|---|
|
connect /kəˈnekt/ B1 |
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airport /ˈeərpɔːrt/ A2 |
|
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handpicked /hændpɪkt/ B2 |
|
|
degree /dɪˈɡriː/ B1 |
|
|
friends /frendz/ A2 |
|
|
homely /ˈhoʊmli/ B1 |
|
|
touring /ˈtʊərɪŋ/ B1 |
|
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comfortable /ˈkʌmfərtəbl/ A2 |
|
|
gypsy /ˈdʒɪpsi/ B2 |
|
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adventurous /ədˈventʃərəs/ B1 |
|
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challenge /ˈtʃælɪndʒ/ B1 |
|
|
wisdom /ˈwɪzdəm/ C1 |
|
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perspective /pərˈspektɪv/ B2 |
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relive /riːˈlɪv/ B2 |
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independent /ˌɪndɪˈpendənt/ B2 |
|
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navel-gazing /ˈneɪvəl ˌɡeɪzɪŋ/ C1 |
|
重点语法结构
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